Mind Over Murder (2022): Season 1, Episode 6 - Episode #1.6 - full transcript
- I am.
You know, if I do this,
is that creating
a noise for you?
- Because, you know,
I shaved this morning,
but my whiskers might
be rubbing on my shirt.
Could give you a.
- Okay.
- What happened to your grandma?
- Well, to be honest,
not everybody believes
the same story.
- All of a sudden,
my sergeant called.
He said, "We need you
up here right away."
When I asked the dispatcher,
they said there
was something about bodies.
- When anything happens,
somebody knows something.
And you have to find
that somebody.
- I have a feeling
that maybe you know
more than you're telling me.
Am I right or wrong that
you left something out yet?
- Possibly, but I'm
having a hard time
remembering everything.
- Do you need a little time
to think about that?
- Yes.
- After we know that
the six don't have anything
to do with it and that
there's no DNA evidence,
we started by reviewing
the physical evidence
from the case.
The details of the crime scene
weren't matching
what I was seeing
in the crime scene photos.
I can do the
same thing they're doing.
- I can badmouth them just like
they're trying to do my case.
Okay?
Same thing.
They're missing
a lot of shit, too.
You can make innuendos
out of anything you want.
Go ahead.
Just keep going.
- My family
has always stood with me.
My community has
always stood with me.
- After he came home,
he didn't like
doors to be closed.
I think he slept
with his bedroom door open.
He said
the first week he was home
that I was glued to him.
He... he...
he said "She never let
me out of her sight."
- No.
Keep it going.
Don't stop it.
I'm just taking care
of something I need to do.
- No, keep it going.
- I'm listening.
I'm listening.
- I just... it's okay.
I'm just making sure that if...
- Trying to learn
the ropes in prison,
you don't really know that...
- Our cell block, it's sort
of like you see in the movies,
where there's...
- Well...
- All these inmates
are whispering...
- I don't need to
hear these people talk
about their life in the pen.
- Because they
take you to your cell
and show you first
to your you cell.
- Really.
- I mean, I got tired
of hearing this in the trial.
You know, it's what they did.
I can't help it.
Mr. Tom... you did it.
I didn't, buddy.
I just investigated,
did what you told me,
and put it on paper.
- I feel sympathy
for anybody that had a problem.
Did I make that problem?
No.
Do I feel sorry for that?
No.
- It's...
- If I make one,
I'll tell you I did.
If I know I did.
It's either/or.
Either you did it
or you didn't do it.
And as far as I'm concerned,
that what they
told me and got...
They got convicted on,
they made that decision
and they're guilty.
You asked me.
I told you.
- After getting out,
I actually drove
through Beatrice.
I wanted to see
the building itself.
I don't even know
why I wanted
to see the building itself,
but I wanted
to see the building.
And it was just sad.
Whole thing's sad.
There are people
that truthfully believe
still to this day
that we were guilty.
They're set so hard
in their minds
that we were bad people.
At first, I used to read
everything that came out...
Facebook posts,
little newspaper article posts
with the comment sections.
"They had to be there."
"There's no way
they're innocent."
Just stuff like that.
Jeff told me it was better
just to stop reading them,
which he's right.
- There are people who believe
that the Earth is flat.
And I don't find
the attitude in Gage County
to be any different.
People will believe
things that are false,
for whatever reason.
After the first trial ended
in a mistrial, we appealed.
And then we're back
for a trial in June of 2016.
- Before the second trial,
we interviewed
several of the jurors
from the 2014 trial,
and they simply were not able
to get themselves to a finding
that something really
outrageous had happened here.
- Three of our clients
cannot tell
a coherent story
about what happened.
So what Maren and I
decided to do
was do the minimal amount
that we could
with Debbie and JoAnn and James.
We had Debbie testify
to just, you know, demonstrate
how vulnerable she is.
- My questions for her
were much more limited.
What's your favorite color?
What's your favorite food?
It was really more
just letting the jury see
how she communicates.
I screwed up in the first trial
by expecting her
to be able to tell her own story
when she doesn't have
that capacity.
And so I realized that there's
a much better witness
who can tell that story
more effectively,
even though it is not
our friend.
It's Wayne Price.
He was a very resistant witness.
He didn't want to agree
with me on anything.
But he was the one
that had treated her.
And so damn it, we can have
him be the one to serve
as the expert on that issue.
With JoAnn,
we used Wayne Price again
to explain JoAnn's illness.
And James also...
We had such an enormous record
of the interviews of James
because he had given
so many statements.
We relied much more on those
statements in the second trial
than we did in the first trial.
- For Tom, it was a matter
of being open
because he was very guarded
about a lot of things.
- I remember Maren and Jeff
coming in and talking to me
at the second trial when I
was getting ready to testify
for the last time.
And I was going over my stuff.
And...
I was telling her
"I just don't know
if I can go out and do this."
And they both looked at me
and said, "You've got this.
You can do it."
So I went out there,
and I locked in
on one of the jurors.
And I just told my story.
When I first got to prison,
I wasn't big like I am now.
I was pretty thin.
I had blond hair,
all of my hair pretty much,
blue eyes.
I was sort of...
I guess you would say
a prison target at that time.
I think I was there
my third day...
Three days maybe?
I was down in the shower area,
and...
the door opened, and...
This huge, um...
Black guy came in.
And it just happened so fast.
That was my first time.
But numerous over
the next few years happened.
Similar things
and similar situations
in similar ways.
Then when my hair
started disappearing and...
I got a little bigger...
I thought,
"Well, it's gonna go away.
"I'm not going to be
the blond-haired,
"blue-eyed fish
on the yard anymore.
They're gonna leave me alone."
And they didn't.
It just kept coming.
The worst part
is you remember everything.
That's the worst part.
You remember their eyes,
their hair, their color.
You remember...
You just remember.
- As hurt as we all got,
I think Tom got hurt the most.
For whatever reason,
in the second trial,
one of the attorneys
just went after him.
- One of them,
I don't remember her name,
stood up on a closing argument
and said,
"Thomas Winslow
deserved to be raped."
- He should have expected
to be raped.
That he deserved to be raped
for going to prison
for a sex crime.
That it shouldn't have come
as a surprise.
- Man, if you'd seen the jurors
after that, it was like, uh.
Yeah.
- No, I think that
Maren and I made
some pretty good closings.
But that comment right there,
as short as it was,
was probably more beneficial
to our case than anything else.
- When reading from a transcript
of my final argument...
"If you feed facts of a crime
into JoAnn's mental illness,
"that is not normal.
"If you take advantage
of Deb's low function
"to convince her
that she's guilty,
"that is not normal.
"If you use your skills
as a psychologist
"to convince Deb and James
to make up new facts,
"that is not normal.
"If you know the blood
and the semen doesn't fit
"and so you encourage
these false confessions
"to dream up new suspects,
that is not normal.
"Their devaluing of human life
could turn any person
"with special needs
into Deb Shelden,
"could turn any person
with a mental illness
"into JoAnn or James,
"could turn any person
who knew someone
"mentally ill or low functioning
"into Joseph or Tom,
"could turn any person
who had the bad luck
to live above a murder victim
into Kathy."
"So what is it going to take
to right these wrongs?
"This is known as the greatest
travesty of justice
"in Nebraska history.
And your verdict needs
to reflect that."
- It's our top story
on 1011 NOW.
It appears the Beatrice Six
will now be paid millions...
- Gage County may have to fork
over a lot of money.
- We're talking $28 million.
- $28.1 million.
- $28 million judgment.
- $28.1 million owed
to the Beatrice Six.
- They won.
They want their money.
And right now,
Gage County can't pay it.
- Gage County doesn't have
$28 million sitting around.
- The county tried
to file for bankruptcy,
but didn't qualify.
- Tonight, a bill
that would allow Gage County
to increase its sales tax
to pay the debt.
- If you live in Gage County,
your taxes will be
higher next year.
- Homeowners
are taking a hit here
with the increase
to property taxes.
- Property owners say
they should not have to foot
the $28.1 million bill.
- Some people say
they won't be shopping
in Beatrice with the increase.
- It's kind of unfair to pay
for somebody's mistakes
from 30 years ago.
- Footing the bill
for something that happened
that we weren't responsible for.
- Most of this stuff happened
when I was around five or six.
So why should we have
to pay for something
we have no knowledge of?
- People don't think that they
would have ever made
that kind of money
being in society.
- The time that
they spent in prison
was probably better time spent,
as far as their lives
are concerned,
than if they would have been
out running the streets.
- How did we celebrate?
With our clients,
we had a get-together
in Holly Pond.
It was at the
White family's church,
which is right next door
to where Lois White lived.
JoAnn, with her wife, was there,
and Tom Winslow
and his new wife.
Kathy wasn't there.
And James wasn't there,
and neither was Debbie.
The one thing
about our clients is,
they were not...
This was not a gang.
This was not a group
of friends back in 1985.
These were people who just
kind of knew each other.
They're tired of being thought
of as the Beatrice Six.
They're tired of being thought
of as victims of something,
and they just want
to move on past that
and be who they are now.
JoAnn Taylor in particular
led such a troubled life,
and she seems to be
now just at peace.
And she wants to put
everything behind her
and live life to its fullest,
and she's just moved on.
And I applaud her for it,
and I'm proud of her for it.
- We got a lot of stuff.
The day I got told
that we had a house,
I was crying,
and I got real excited.
I went into the bedroom
and woke up Clifford
and I told him,
I said, "We own a house now.
We're a house owner."
And I said, "It's ours."
And so he got up
and squished me to death.
And he was crying.
We were all excited, yeah.
- We're all ready.
Ready to go.
- I'm ready to go, yeah.
Just got to get the stuff
over there and get in.
- Here, give me your hand.
- Here.
Okay, I got it now.
- You got it?
- Yeah, I got it.
It smells good in here.
It smells nice and clean.
- Yeah.
- Look at all this shine.
This is our kitchen.
Yeah, this is the kitchen.
This is the closet
where all the goodies go.
Ooh, my goodness.
Walk-in closet there.
Jesus, that's a thingamajiggy.
You want that off?
- Oh, Okay.
- Okay, well, there.
There's a bathroom.
- Well, thanks
for leaving me in the dark.
- This is the main bedroom here.
And there's your wall
back there.
Oh, that big ceiling fan.
Look at that.
Oh, honey!
- What?
- They left a fish tank.
- Did they?
- Yep, it's down here bubbling.
I can hear it bubbling.
- Oh, they did!
- Yes, they did.
It's on, too. See?
They just fly around in there.
You know,
these things are relaxing.
Fish tanks.
They make you relaxed
if you got stress
and all that stuff.
I love fish.
For a long time,
I didn't like
the situation I was living.
I was homeless 2013,
and '14, and '15.
Yep, I was homeless,
but we lived in our van.
We'd park
in a Walmart parking lot.
That all changed because
I'm all done with the trials.
Verdict was on our side.
I got money coming
in a trust fund.
I-I'm done with it,
and I feel a lot better.
- Our family,
who are taxpayers
in Gage County,
are now paying the Beatrice Six
for what they did to my grandma.
And when I say that,
even if they didn't do
what they testified to,
they still testified to it.
And that's
why we're in this situation.
They were wrongly convicted
because they lied on the stand
if, in fact, they did.
So they put
themselves in prison.
- I don't really feel
there's a lot of closure
because of...
me having to
pay some people that...
I personally believe
might have
something to do with this.
You know, I was kind
of paying for it twice
because I had a business.
You know, and then when
you go buy something,
you pay sales tax on it.
So, you know, and then
you pay property taxes.
That goes towards it.
I don't feel I should
have to pay for that.
I don't feel anybody around here
should have to pay for that.
- And we know they were there.
Our whole family does.
Then they get millions of
dollars, and we get jack shit?
- Now to a real life drama
that's being played out
at the Beatrice
community theater.
- The show is called
"Gage County, Nebraska"
and is about the Beatrice Six.
- People that are actually
involved in the story
are actually going to attend.
- The script for the play
was put together
using trial transcripts,
public records,
and input
from the actors themselves,
almost all of whom are
from Beatrice or Lincoln.
- We hope that will be a place
of reconciliation
and of healing.
- Putting together the play
didn't come
without its challenges.
Some in the community
were against revisiting
such a painful story.
- Hello?
- Hey, Stan.
What's going on?
Hey, did you ask
who's gonna go or not?
- How comes they're...
They're not coming?
Is it because of
all their work and stuff or...
- Yeah.
- I mean, we've been stabbed
in the back, hurt so many times
it's... it's unreal.
By the news media, especially.
- The people
that I have talked to
were angry about this whole
thing being reopened, I guess,
and brought back,
because it's like
it happened all over again.
- It's gonna stir up
a lotta feelings
in the community that don't
need to be stirred up, really.
- So just real quick
logistic things for tomorrow.
We were very aware of
the social media feedback
that this project was receiving
into a very gossipy
social media group.
And our response was that
we acknowledge their concern
and we invite them
to reach out to us directly
to schedule
an in-person conversation.
- There were several people
who were accusing us of being
just as bad as people involved
with the murder.
- The worst one I saw said
that the same thing
that happened to Mrs. Wilson
should happen to the cast.
That was the one that scared me.
- That was...
That one is frightening.
- Yeah.
- And when the show is over,
can you men walk us
to our cars...
- Absolutely.
- Because...
- Well, and I'm worried about...
- That's scary.
- It's not even
so much this weekend.
It's what happens if you run
into someone in a week?
- Right, yeah.
- Yeah.
- I thought about that a lot.
We all... a lot of us have
very public jobs
that we don't have protection.
- We are taking some
proactive steps
to make sure
that you guys are secure.
Um... the stage door is locked
during the performances.
We have asked
the Beatrice Police Department
to make sure
that we've got some presence
on the nights of the show,
just...
just in case anyone
is feeling a little spunky,
you will be safe.
I promise you that.
So don't worry about that.
- Welcome.
This production may not be
exactly what you're expecting.
- The words spoken by the actors
are from interviews...
- Trial transcripts...
- And the public record.
- Actors will play
the roles of the Beatrice Six
and take on parts
of prosecutors,
investigators, jurors,
and Beatrice community members,
including members
of the family of Helen Wilson.
- Parts of it may be
uncomfortable to hear,
but we appreciate
that you've come tonight
with an open mind.
- Scene 1.
"News About the Murder."
- Mrs. Wilson's body was found
in the living room,
and the pathologist determined
that Helen Wilson died
from suffocation.
- Burdette Searcey.
- Every now and then,
the Helen Wilson thing
would come up,
and it's like,
nothing's happening.
I said to the sheriff,
"I think I can solve this."
- Scene 3.
"Burt Searcey Questions
Lisa Podendorf."
- The morning after the murder,
JoAnn come up to me and says,
"I know why
those police cars were
at that apartment building
over there."
And they said they killed her,
just killed this lady.
- Scene 5.
"Burt Searcey Questions
Tom Winslow."
- I did not do this.
- Bullshit, Tom!
You were there!
I got people telling me
exactly what you did
to that woman.
You butt-fucked her.
- Scene 8.
"Burt Searcey Questions
JoAnn Taylor."
- JoAnn, how is it
that you can remember
some things
and then not other things?
- That's the way my mind is.
It's fucked up, literally!
- Scene 14.
"Deb Shelden's Arrest
and Interrogation."
- And how many people
did you say
was involved
in the incident yesterday?
- Three.
Tom Winslow, JoAnn Taylor,
and Joseph White.
- And who else?
- I was there.
- And today,
you're telling us there's...
- Five.
- And now James Dean's involved,
and you couldn't remember
that yesterday.
Is that what you're telling us?
- For 22 days in that cell
I kept saying,
"I don't know
what you're talking about."
Then they showed me the video
of Mrs. Wilson
and the crime scene.
I couldn't sleep.
I couldn't stop crying.
I was having nightmares
and banging on the walls,
screaming a lot.
- Scene 18.
"Dr. Wayne Price interviews
Kathy Gonzalez."
- Odds are, it looks
like you were there
and blocked it.
And you can help yourself
out by remembering.
- Usually, what happens is
pieces will start to come
back to you in dreams,
and then it will become clear.
- Joe White's defense attorney,
Tony Redman.
- Ms. Taylor, do you feel
that you have
mental telepathy capabilities?
- Yes. I'm learning
how to astral project.
It's when you can send your soul
to another place or person.
I'm just
a beginning-level psychic.
- The people who testified
against me
were threatened
with the death penalty...
Just like I was.
- Former County Attorney
Dick Smith takes the stand.
- Mr. Smith, in 1989,
you received a letter
from a private company
who was doing DNA testing
at the time.
- I made a judgment
that that kind of evidence
wouldn't be admissible in court.
- Former Gage County
Sheriff's Deputy
Burt Searcey takes the stand.
- So you stop the tape.
And now, after the break,
all of a sudden,
she has a memory
of this other boy.
Right?
- That's what she said.
- Wayne Price, you knew
Deb Shelden, didn't you?
You knew that she was troubled.
- Yes.
- What did you know
about how
Deb Shelden and James Dean
identified Kathy Gonzalez?
- They'd identified her in...
In a dream.
- And did that bother you?
- No.
- Kathy Gonzalez.
- Maybe the six of us
were bad Americans,
but we were still Americans.
We had civil rights.
They weren't getting
anywhere in this case,
so they found a bunch
of disposable people.
And that was us.
- Scene 32.
"Compensation, No Closure."
- The Beatrice Six won
the civil suit in 2016,
an award of $28.6 million.
- This judgment is too much
for Gage County farmers.
DNA proved someone else
did the rape,
but no one can prove
that the six weren't there!
Bruce Allen Smith
could have showed up
after the six murdered
Mrs. Wilson then raped her.
Exactly!
- The crime scene evidence shows
that Smith's blood
was mixed with Mrs. Wilson's
in the bedroom.
So you're telling me that
Bruce Allen Smith was
already bleeding profusely
when he entered the apartment
or he cut himself
when he was there
and attacked Helen Wilson's
dead body?
- But this whole case
is based on these people
testifying against each other.
So how much sense does it make
that Smith was there
and nobody mentioned his name?
- Hey!
We can't quite let it go,
because to let it go would mean
that everything we believe
is totally wrong.
And that's really hard to do.
- Stenciled on the wall of
the Beatrice Police Department
are the words,
"What do you think?
What do you know?
What can you prove?"
In memory of Helen Wilson.
- I thought about it
all night last night.
And I was really confused
at first,
'cause you got
these two thoughts
going on in your head.
For so many years,
I believed one thing,
and I was torn.
I-I always had this in the back
of my mind that, you know,
something's really
not right here.
And, uh, I really had
to know... know the truth.
I had to feel it.
And...
last night made me feel it.
And it wasn't nothing
like I thought.
- Last night was the first time
I've ever heard Bob think that...
Out loud, think
that they might be innocent.
But in my mind, since
they had been pardoned,
I had come to the conclusion
that they were probably
innocent,
but nobody else in the family
had ever voiced that.
And I was on the outside
looking in, really.
I was a daughter-in-law.
So then when... after last night
when Bob was, you know, saying,
"Hey, they could be innocent,"
I finally was able to, you know,
talk with him more about it.
- The person I really,
really feel sorry for
is the White family
'cause he's the only one
that said that he was innocent.
He didn't deserve what he got.
His family
didn't deserve what they got.
- What do you think?
- I don't know.
It's up to you, Bob.
Come on in.
- You made it.
I made it.
- Thankfully.
My name's Bob.
- I'm Lois.
- Nice to meet you, Lois.
- Nice to meet you.
- Hi, Bob.
- Hi. You're?
- Nancy.
- Nancy.
Nice to meet you, Nancy.
Want to have
a seat at the table?
- All right.
- Tell me about your son
a little bit, could you?
- Well, he was a typical
teenager growing up.
And he was always
kind of a mama's boy.
He was always laughing
about something.
He was my clown.
- Yeah.
I did see him at the trial.
And he seemed like he was
a pretty confident
and composed-type person.
- Joseph had enough
self-confidence
for a room full of people.
When we were growing up,
faith in yourself,
believe in yourself.
It's where you have to start.
- That's kind of the impression
I got from last night.
It made me think
quite a bit, you know.
All those years, we've been
told one thing, you know,
and, uh...
you really don't
know any different, you know?
And when you go through
such a loss like we did...
it was...
- That was terrible.
- It was pretty tragic for us
because she was
the hub of our family.
She... yeah.
I've always believed
that God has
a strange way of doing things.
But there's some lessons
to be learned here somewhere.
You know? And...
mine is really not
to prejudge people
without really knowing
what's really going on.
Now, I thought
I was always that way,
but I guess I wasn't.
I really, really feel sorry
for what you guys went through.
I really...
It's not fair to anybody.
It's not fair to any of us.
- Yep.
- We'll heal.
- Yeah, and I'm glad
that I could be a part
of your healing.
- Thank you.
I'm glad you're part of mine.
- Shane's calling.
- Hi, Shane.
Man, I haven't slept
for two nights.
I been awake for two days
'cause I can't sleep.
I was so worried about
how you would feel about...
You guys would feel about
how the way I feel about it now.
I really wish you could
have been here for this...
- It would have opened up
your eyes.
And it might have made you think
a little more about things,
because it did me.
And, you know, Shane,
I'm not thinking
like I used to think.
- Mom and Dad...
- It's hard to digest
that they weren't there,
that this was all made up.
That, in their minds,
they started believing it.
And it comes from their dreams.
- What I found with me was,
I put it in my mind
the way I wanted
to put it in my mind.
You know,
I twisted things around
that would fit my conclusion...
I don't know how to put it...
To satisfy your own
need for closure.
- You know?
And...
- It was just
a lot of mistakes made.
And a lot of strange
things happened
that don't make sense.
- And very gullible people
that could be talked
into doing anything.
- Doing anything.
That's... and that's the problem.
You know?
- And the only one
they couldn't talk
to do anything was Joseph White.
- Yeah.
- And he stood his ground.
- Joseph White's
mother and sister,
'cause they were at the play,
they came over to our house.
And we sat at the table.
And we talked for, what,
2 1/2 hours, 2 hours?
And we had a really nice talk.
And she... they're
really nice people, Shane.
She's a sweet lady.
His mom's a sweet lady.
I really liked her a lot.
- And she...
You know, she was hurt.
She said, I lost my
son for 18 years, and then...
For however long it was...
And then he come home.
And then he got killed.
And, man... you know?
No.
- No.
- I'm sorry, bud.
I thought I had to tell you that
because I thought
you needed to know.
I didn't want you to hear it
from somebody else.
You know what I'm saying?
No.
- That's not what we're saying.
We still feel the same
about Burt as we did before.
- Yeah, nothing will change
our feelings about Burt.
He was just doing his job.
- Yeah.
- Our kids, Cody,
Ashley, and Britney,
they went to the play.
Ashley, she thought
that it showed
a lot of sympathy,
empathy for the Beatrice Six.
She was surprised that there
was some profanity in it
'cause the actor that played
Burt said, "Bullshit!"
More than that.
I had... when I was questioning
Tom Winslow
in the one interview, I said,
"Well, you butt fucked her,
didn't you?"
You know?
- Oh!
- And she was surprised.
- Oh, that's what it was!
- She was surprised
that that was...
- Yes, that's what it was.
And I can't believe
she said it out loud
in front of my grandchildren,
but she did.
And we really wanted
to attend it,
but Burt was playing
in a golf tournament
that went past our time.
- I had committed to that
well in advance.
- Yeah, and I didn't
want to go alone,
and I had already agreed
to watch
the children on Sunday.
So that's why we did
not get to see it.
- I would like to hope
that people somewhat get
a little bit of, uh...
More knowledge about what
and how everything was done
back in the '80s
and understand
that what was done
was done technically
and pretty much done correctly
as it should have been.
And there was a lot of things,
you know, that I think show
that they were just as
guilty in the situation
as there's a lot of things
that people might want
to think show them innocent.
- I understand that.
I'm saying I can understand
how the court and a jury
decided that,
but I think there was
a lot of factual basis and...
That show both sides.
I know that you're sitting
over here saying, well,
you know, he didn't give me
the answer I wanted.
I can't. Okay?
And the reason I can't,
I can't say something
I fully don't believe.
- I don't believe
they're innocent.
I've already told you that.
I only accept
what I know happened,
what I seen happen,
and I can't make it change.
Is that fair?
Yep.
- Are we done?
- Okay.
You know, I don't know
how else to answer,
because here's the deal,
will I accept the civil trial's
jury verdict?
Yes. I will.
I have to.
- You have to understand...
Okay, he's still filming.
You've gotta shut
that thing off!
- So I'll say something to you.
So when you're coming
after me to want me to say
certain things
and you're pushing on me...
Okay, I'm just telling you
my feeling at the time.
I'm going to put my shell on.
- I don't know.
Give me time.
- Give me time.
Will I sit there and say,
"Oh my God,
I know we did wrong, and all
that, and I can't help it?"
No, I'm not.
I'm not gonna do it.
I did my job
to the best of my ability.
My job is not to make you happy
because that's
what you want me to say.
I'm not going to say that.
That ain't my job.
My job was to do,
collect, gather,
give it to someone else,
and they determined that.
That's all I did.
- I just told you, I'll accept.
- I'll accept it.
I don't have to agree with it.
That's as... that's all I know.
How's that?
I'm not gonna tell you
they're innocent,
'cause I can't prove
that either.
I will tell you, I'll accept
the verdict of the court
that they are innocent.
And I know there was a lot
of mistakes made that I know.
There's a lot of things
I don't know.
- Yeah.
- I feel better
that he said that.
You know, just getting you
to say it is tough.
- Exactly.
- Yeah.
Been carrying this
around for so long
that it's just consumed
our lives.
Hope that he'd open
his mind up a little bit more
to possibility that
something else happened
than what he imagined
and what he believed.
I've always hoped that he
would consider the possibility
that maybe they were innocent.
If he can accept that,
then maybe the family,
and his friends,
and others can accept that.
And then we can all
move on from this
and... and let it go.
- How are you?
Behaving?
- Hey, kiddo.
- Hey.
How's it going?
- I'm good.
How are you?
- Good.
- So good morning to all of you.
Thank you.
This is gonna be hard.
Thank you so much
for being here.
We are here today
to find closure
and live
the rest of our lives thinking
about who Grandma was
and who she made us.
We're planting a tree into
the ground and giving it life.
This is Grandma's life to
live on, in my opinion.
That's what this means to me.
The branches are Bob,
and John, and Jan,
and Stanley, and Tad, and
Mark, and Nicole, all of us.
Today is about who she was,
not what happened.
If anybody would like to
come and grab some dirt
and put some dirt
around the hole,
you're welcome to do that
before we finish planting
this thing.
So help yourself up here
if you'd like to do that.
- Do you want a shovel?
- Nope.
I'm gonna do it just like this.
- Thank you, Burt.
- Thank you, Burt.
- I called Burt
to personally invite him here
to the dedication.
He's been made out to be
the villain in all of this,
and Burt is not a villain.
I do believe that he did his job
and he arrested the people
that he thought did it.
- Oh, you're pushing
me in a direction
I don't really want to go.
I'm not prepared
to hang Burt out.
I'm still not willing to believe
that the Beatrice Six
didn't know about it.
They possibly knew
Bruce Allen Smith,
and he may or may not have
told them what he did.
That's where my beliefs are
right now.
- We know the truth now.
It was proven
without a shadow of a doubt.
I just think people need to...
open up their hearts
and minds to it
so they can understand,
really, what it was.
Not just the ending, not just
the beginning, not the middle.
Just what the whole thing
caused from start to finish.
- Everybody's like,
"Well, isn't it nice
that it's over?"
As long as I live in this state,
someone will bring this up.
That will be my life.
But I keep the screaming
to a minimum.
I keep the crying to a minimum.
That's the best I can do,
Because we got hurt.
All of us got hurt.
- If you want my opinion,
I feel bad for Gage County.
Not bad enough I'ma
tell them not to pay me money,
you know?
But they're paying for something
somebody else did,
just like we did.
I feel really bad
for the family.
The Sheriff's Department
at Gage County
not only brainwashed us,
but they brainwashed them, too.
- You know, it's so hard
when you believed
a story for 35 years...
and then you're being told, no,
you don't believe that anymore
'cause that's not true.
I know enough to know
that they didn't do
anything to Grandma.
The rest of it,
I'm sure I will end up with
they had zero to do
with any of this.
But my brain just
isn't quite there yet.
I don't think anyone's brain
is equipped
to just flip
the switch like that.
It takes time.
- I went through a lot of drama,
an ordeal that I never expected
to go through.
I tell everybody,
if I knew now what I know then,
I would have changed a lot
of things, a lot of things.
- Deb isn't, to this day,
quite sure just what happened.
- She still feels
she was involved.
That's how bad
they brainwashed her.
Sad, but true.
- We all live with this
feeling helpless and confused.
But Deb...
Deb's on a deeper level
with living with it.
- Took me a long time,
but I realized I wasn't there.
I realized none of it,
none of it was true.
I know I'm not guilty,
and I know I've been
all done with that.
But I remember going
to the apartment, yeah.
Like I said, I never saw
a dead person
in my entire life
till that... till that time.
'Cause I see it in my dreams.
You know, if I do this,
is that creating
a noise for you?
- Because, you know,
I shaved this morning,
but my whiskers might
be rubbing on my shirt.
Could give you a.
- Okay.
- What happened to your grandma?
- Well, to be honest,
not everybody believes
the same story.
- All of a sudden,
my sergeant called.
He said, "We need you
up here right away."
When I asked the dispatcher,
they said there
was something about bodies.
- When anything happens,
somebody knows something.
And you have to find
that somebody.
- I have a feeling
that maybe you know
more than you're telling me.
Am I right or wrong that
you left something out yet?
- Possibly, but I'm
having a hard time
remembering everything.
- Do you need a little time
to think about that?
- Yes.
- After we know that
the six don't have anything
to do with it and that
there's no DNA evidence,
we started by reviewing
the physical evidence
from the case.
The details of the crime scene
weren't matching
what I was seeing
in the crime scene photos.
I can do the
same thing they're doing.
- I can badmouth them just like
they're trying to do my case.
Okay?
Same thing.
They're missing
a lot of shit, too.
You can make innuendos
out of anything you want.
Go ahead.
Just keep going.
- My family
has always stood with me.
My community has
always stood with me.
- After he came home,
he didn't like
doors to be closed.
I think he slept
with his bedroom door open.
He said
the first week he was home
that I was glued to him.
He... he...
he said "She never let
me out of her sight."
- No.
Keep it going.
Don't stop it.
I'm just taking care
of something I need to do.
- No, keep it going.
- I'm listening.
I'm listening.
- I just... it's okay.
I'm just making sure that if...
- Trying to learn
the ropes in prison,
you don't really know that...
- Our cell block, it's sort
of like you see in the movies,
where there's...
- Well...
- All these inmates
are whispering...
- I don't need to
hear these people talk
about their life in the pen.
- Because they
take you to your cell
and show you first
to your you cell.
- Really.
- I mean, I got tired
of hearing this in the trial.
You know, it's what they did.
I can't help it.
Mr. Tom... you did it.
I didn't, buddy.
I just investigated,
did what you told me,
and put it on paper.
- I feel sympathy
for anybody that had a problem.
Did I make that problem?
No.
Do I feel sorry for that?
No.
- It's...
- If I make one,
I'll tell you I did.
If I know I did.
It's either/or.
Either you did it
or you didn't do it.
And as far as I'm concerned,
that what they
told me and got...
They got convicted on,
they made that decision
and they're guilty.
You asked me.
I told you.
- After getting out,
I actually drove
through Beatrice.
I wanted to see
the building itself.
I don't even know
why I wanted
to see the building itself,
but I wanted
to see the building.
And it was just sad.
Whole thing's sad.
There are people
that truthfully believe
still to this day
that we were guilty.
They're set so hard
in their minds
that we were bad people.
At first, I used to read
everything that came out...
Facebook posts,
little newspaper article posts
with the comment sections.
"They had to be there."
"There's no way
they're innocent."
Just stuff like that.
Jeff told me it was better
just to stop reading them,
which he's right.
- There are people who believe
that the Earth is flat.
And I don't find
the attitude in Gage County
to be any different.
People will believe
things that are false,
for whatever reason.
After the first trial ended
in a mistrial, we appealed.
And then we're back
for a trial in June of 2016.
- Before the second trial,
we interviewed
several of the jurors
from the 2014 trial,
and they simply were not able
to get themselves to a finding
that something really
outrageous had happened here.
- Three of our clients
cannot tell
a coherent story
about what happened.
So what Maren and I
decided to do
was do the minimal amount
that we could
with Debbie and JoAnn and James.
We had Debbie testify
to just, you know, demonstrate
how vulnerable she is.
- My questions for her
were much more limited.
What's your favorite color?
What's your favorite food?
It was really more
just letting the jury see
how she communicates.
I screwed up in the first trial
by expecting her
to be able to tell her own story
when she doesn't have
that capacity.
And so I realized that there's
a much better witness
who can tell that story
more effectively,
even though it is not
our friend.
It's Wayne Price.
He was a very resistant witness.
He didn't want to agree
with me on anything.
But he was the one
that had treated her.
And so damn it, we can have
him be the one to serve
as the expert on that issue.
With JoAnn,
we used Wayne Price again
to explain JoAnn's illness.
And James also...
We had such an enormous record
of the interviews of James
because he had given
so many statements.
We relied much more on those
statements in the second trial
than we did in the first trial.
- For Tom, it was a matter
of being open
because he was very guarded
about a lot of things.
- I remember Maren and Jeff
coming in and talking to me
at the second trial when I
was getting ready to testify
for the last time.
And I was going over my stuff.
And...
I was telling her
"I just don't know
if I can go out and do this."
And they both looked at me
and said, "You've got this.
You can do it."
So I went out there,
and I locked in
on one of the jurors.
And I just told my story.
When I first got to prison,
I wasn't big like I am now.
I was pretty thin.
I had blond hair,
all of my hair pretty much,
blue eyes.
I was sort of...
I guess you would say
a prison target at that time.
I think I was there
my third day...
Three days maybe?
I was down in the shower area,
and...
the door opened, and...
This huge, um...
Black guy came in.
And it just happened so fast.
That was my first time.
But numerous over
the next few years happened.
Similar things
and similar situations
in similar ways.
Then when my hair
started disappearing and...
I got a little bigger...
I thought,
"Well, it's gonna go away.
"I'm not going to be
the blond-haired,
"blue-eyed fish
on the yard anymore.
They're gonna leave me alone."
And they didn't.
It just kept coming.
The worst part
is you remember everything.
That's the worst part.
You remember their eyes,
their hair, their color.
You remember...
You just remember.
- As hurt as we all got,
I think Tom got hurt the most.
For whatever reason,
in the second trial,
one of the attorneys
just went after him.
- One of them,
I don't remember her name,
stood up on a closing argument
and said,
"Thomas Winslow
deserved to be raped."
- He should have expected
to be raped.
That he deserved to be raped
for going to prison
for a sex crime.
That it shouldn't have come
as a surprise.
- Man, if you'd seen the jurors
after that, it was like, uh.
Yeah.
- No, I think that
Maren and I made
some pretty good closings.
But that comment right there,
as short as it was,
was probably more beneficial
to our case than anything else.
- When reading from a transcript
of my final argument...
"If you feed facts of a crime
into JoAnn's mental illness,
"that is not normal.
"If you take advantage
of Deb's low function
"to convince her
that she's guilty,
"that is not normal.
"If you use your skills
as a psychologist
"to convince Deb and James
to make up new facts,
"that is not normal.
"If you know the blood
and the semen doesn't fit
"and so you encourage
these false confessions
"to dream up new suspects,
that is not normal.
"Their devaluing of human life
could turn any person
"with special needs
into Deb Shelden,
"could turn any person
with a mental illness
"into JoAnn or James,
"could turn any person
who knew someone
"mentally ill or low functioning
"into Joseph or Tom,
"could turn any person
who had the bad luck
to live above a murder victim
into Kathy."
"So what is it going to take
to right these wrongs?
"This is known as the greatest
travesty of justice
"in Nebraska history.
And your verdict needs
to reflect that."
- It's our top story
on 1011 NOW.
It appears the Beatrice Six
will now be paid millions...
- Gage County may have to fork
over a lot of money.
- We're talking $28 million.
- $28.1 million.
- $28 million judgment.
- $28.1 million owed
to the Beatrice Six.
- They won.
They want their money.
And right now,
Gage County can't pay it.
- Gage County doesn't have
$28 million sitting around.
- The county tried
to file for bankruptcy,
but didn't qualify.
- Tonight, a bill
that would allow Gage County
to increase its sales tax
to pay the debt.
- If you live in Gage County,
your taxes will be
higher next year.
- Homeowners
are taking a hit here
with the increase
to property taxes.
- Property owners say
they should not have to foot
the $28.1 million bill.
- Some people say
they won't be shopping
in Beatrice with the increase.
- It's kind of unfair to pay
for somebody's mistakes
from 30 years ago.
- Footing the bill
for something that happened
that we weren't responsible for.
- Most of this stuff happened
when I was around five or six.
So why should we have
to pay for something
we have no knowledge of?
- People don't think that they
would have ever made
that kind of money
being in society.
- The time that
they spent in prison
was probably better time spent,
as far as their lives
are concerned,
than if they would have been
out running the streets.
- How did we celebrate?
With our clients,
we had a get-together
in Holly Pond.
It was at the
White family's church,
which is right next door
to where Lois White lived.
JoAnn, with her wife, was there,
and Tom Winslow
and his new wife.
Kathy wasn't there.
And James wasn't there,
and neither was Debbie.
The one thing
about our clients is,
they were not...
This was not a gang.
This was not a group
of friends back in 1985.
These were people who just
kind of knew each other.
They're tired of being thought
of as the Beatrice Six.
They're tired of being thought
of as victims of something,
and they just want
to move on past that
and be who they are now.
JoAnn Taylor in particular
led such a troubled life,
and she seems to be
now just at peace.
And she wants to put
everything behind her
and live life to its fullest,
and she's just moved on.
And I applaud her for it,
and I'm proud of her for it.
- We got a lot of stuff.
The day I got told
that we had a house,
I was crying,
and I got real excited.
I went into the bedroom
and woke up Clifford
and I told him,
I said, "We own a house now.
We're a house owner."
And I said, "It's ours."
And so he got up
and squished me to death.
And he was crying.
We were all excited, yeah.
- We're all ready.
Ready to go.
- I'm ready to go, yeah.
Just got to get the stuff
over there and get in.
- Here, give me your hand.
- Here.
Okay, I got it now.
- You got it?
- Yeah, I got it.
It smells good in here.
It smells nice and clean.
- Yeah.
- Look at all this shine.
This is our kitchen.
Yeah, this is the kitchen.
This is the closet
where all the goodies go.
Ooh, my goodness.
Walk-in closet there.
Jesus, that's a thingamajiggy.
You want that off?
- Oh, Okay.
- Okay, well, there.
There's a bathroom.
- Well, thanks
for leaving me in the dark.
- This is the main bedroom here.
And there's your wall
back there.
Oh, that big ceiling fan.
Look at that.
Oh, honey!
- What?
- They left a fish tank.
- Did they?
- Yep, it's down here bubbling.
I can hear it bubbling.
- Oh, they did!
- Yes, they did.
It's on, too. See?
They just fly around in there.
You know,
these things are relaxing.
Fish tanks.
They make you relaxed
if you got stress
and all that stuff.
I love fish.
For a long time,
I didn't like
the situation I was living.
I was homeless 2013,
and '14, and '15.
Yep, I was homeless,
but we lived in our van.
We'd park
in a Walmart parking lot.
That all changed because
I'm all done with the trials.
Verdict was on our side.
I got money coming
in a trust fund.
I-I'm done with it,
and I feel a lot better.
- Our family,
who are taxpayers
in Gage County,
are now paying the Beatrice Six
for what they did to my grandma.
And when I say that,
even if they didn't do
what they testified to,
they still testified to it.
And that's
why we're in this situation.
They were wrongly convicted
because they lied on the stand
if, in fact, they did.
So they put
themselves in prison.
- I don't really feel
there's a lot of closure
because of...
me having to
pay some people that...
I personally believe
might have
something to do with this.
You know, I was kind
of paying for it twice
because I had a business.
You know, and then when
you go buy something,
you pay sales tax on it.
So, you know, and then
you pay property taxes.
That goes towards it.
I don't feel I should
have to pay for that.
I don't feel anybody around here
should have to pay for that.
- And we know they were there.
Our whole family does.
Then they get millions of
dollars, and we get jack shit?
- Now to a real life drama
that's being played out
at the Beatrice
community theater.
- The show is called
"Gage County, Nebraska"
and is about the Beatrice Six.
- People that are actually
involved in the story
are actually going to attend.
- The script for the play
was put together
using trial transcripts,
public records,
and input
from the actors themselves,
almost all of whom are
from Beatrice or Lincoln.
- We hope that will be a place
of reconciliation
and of healing.
- Putting together the play
didn't come
without its challenges.
Some in the community
were against revisiting
such a painful story.
- Hello?
- Hey, Stan.
What's going on?
Hey, did you ask
who's gonna go or not?
- How comes they're...
They're not coming?
Is it because of
all their work and stuff or...
- Yeah.
- I mean, we've been stabbed
in the back, hurt so many times
it's... it's unreal.
By the news media, especially.
- The people
that I have talked to
were angry about this whole
thing being reopened, I guess,
and brought back,
because it's like
it happened all over again.
- It's gonna stir up
a lotta feelings
in the community that don't
need to be stirred up, really.
- So just real quick
logistic things for tomorrow.
We were very aware of
the social media feedback
that this project was receiving
into a very gossipy
social media group.
And our response was that
we acknowledge their concern
and we invite them
to reach out to us directly
to schedule
an in-person conversation.
- There were several people
who were accusing us of being
just as bad as people involved
with the murder.
- The worst one I saw said
that the same thing
that happened to Mrs. Wilson
should happen to the cast.
That was the one that scared me.
- That was...
That one is frightening.
- Yeah.
- And when the show is over,
can you men walk us
to our cars...
- Absolutely.
- Because...
- Well, and I'm worried about...
- That's scary.
- It's not even
so much this weekend.
It's what happens if you run
into someone in a week?
- Right, yeah.
- Yeah.
- I thought about that a lot.
We all... a lot of us have
very public jobs
that we don't have protection.
- We are taking some
proactive steps
to make sure
that you guys are secure.
Um... the stage door is locked
during the performances.
We have asked
the Beatrice Police Department
to make sure
that we've got some presence
on the nights of the show,
just...
just in case anyone
is feeling a little spunky,
you will be safe.
I promise you that.
So don't worry about that.
- Welcome.
This production may not be
exactly what you're expecting.
- The words spoken by the actors
are from interviews...
- Trial transcripts...
- And the public record.
- Actors will play
the roles of the Beatrice Six
and take on parts
of prosecutors,
investigators, jurors,
and Beatrice community members,
including members
of the family of Helen Wilson.
- Parts of it may be
uncomfortable to hear,
but we appreciate
that you've come tonight
with an open mind.
- Scene 1.
"News About the Murder."
- Mrs. Wilson's body was found
in the living room,
and the pathologist determined
that Helen Wilson died
from suffocation.
- Burdette Searcey.
- Every now and then,
the Helen Wilson thing
would come up,
and it's like,
nothing's happening.
I said to the sheriff,
"I think I can solve this."
- Scene 3.
"Burt Searcey Questions
Lisa Podendorf."
- The morning after the murder,
JoAnn come up to me and says,
"I know why
those police cars were
at that apartment building
over there."
And they said they killed her,
just killed this lady.
- Scene 5.
"Burt Searcey Questions
Tom Winslow."
- I did not do this.
- Bullshit, Tom!
You were there!
I got people telling me
exactly what you did
to that woman.
You butt-fucked her.
- Scene 8.
"Burt Searcey Questions
JoAnn Taylor."
- JoAnn, how is it
that you can remember
some things
and then not other things?
- That's the way my mind is.
It's fucked up, literally!
- Scene 14.
"Deb Shelden's Arrest
and Interrogation."
- And how many people
did you say
was involved
in the incident yesterday?
- Three.
Tom Winslow, JoAnn Taylor,
and Joseph White.
- And who else?
- I was there.
- And today,
you're telling us there's...
- Five.
- And now James Dean's involved,
and you couldn't remember
that yesterday.
Is that what you're telling us?
- For 22 days in that cell
I kept saying,
"I don't know
what you're talking about."
Then they showed me the video
of Mrs. Wilson
and the crime scene.
I couldn't sleep.
I couldn't stop crying.
I was having nightmares
and banging on the walls,
screaming a lot.
- Scene 18.
"Dr. Wayne Price interviews
Kathy Gonzalez."
- Odds are, it looks
like you were there
and blocked it.
And you can help yourself
out by remembering.
- Usually, what happens is
pieces will start to come
back to you in dreams,
and then it will become clear.
- Joe White's defense attorney,
Tony Redman.
- Ms. Taylor, do you feel
that you have
mental telepathy capabilities?
- Yes. I'm learning
how to astral project.
It's when you can send your soul
to another place or person.
I'm just
a beginning-level psychic.
- The people who testified
against me
were threatened
with the death penalty...
Just like I was.
- Former County Attorney
Dick Smith takes the stand.
- Mr. Smith, in 1989,
you received a letter
from a private company
who was doing DNA testing
at the time.
- I made a judgment
that that kind of evidence
wouldn't be admissible in court.
- Former Gage County
Sheriff's Deputy
Burt Searcey takes the stand.
- So you stop the tape.
And now, after the break,
all of a sudden,
she has a memory
of this other boy.
Right?
- That's what she said.
- Wayne Price, you knew
Deb Shelden, didn't you?
You knew that she was troubled.
- Yes.
- What did you know
about how
Deb Shelden and James Dean
identified Kathy Gonzalez?
- They'd identified her in...
In a dream.
- And did that bother you?
- No.
- Kathy Gonzalez.
- Maybe the six of us
were bad Americans,
but we were still Americans.
We had civil rights.
They weren't getting
anywhere in this case,
so they found a bunch
of disposable people.
And that was us.
- Scene 32.
"Compensation, No Closure."
- The Beatrice Six won
the civil suit in 2016,
an award of $28.6 million.
- This judgment is too much
for Gage County farmers.
DNA proved someone else
did the rape,
but no one can prove
that the six weren't there!
Bruce Allen Smith
could have showed up
after the six murdered
Mrs. Wilson then raped her.
Exactly!
- The crime scene evidence shows
that Smith's blood
was mixed with Mrs. Wilson's
in the bedroom.
So you're telling me that
Bruce Allen Smith was
already bleeding profusely
when he entered the apartment
or he cut himself
when he was there
and attacked Helen Wilson's
dead body?
- But this whole case
is based on these people
testifying against each other.
So how much sense does it make
that Smith was there
and nobody mentioned his name?
- Hey!
We can't quite let it go,
because to let it go would mean
that everything we believe
is totally wrong.
And that's really hard to do.
- Stenciled on the wall of
the Beatrice Police Department
are the words,
"What do you think?
What do you know?
What can you prove?"
In memory of Helen Wilson.
- I thought about it
all night last night.
And I was really confused
at first,
'cause you got
these two thoughts
going on in your head.
For so many years,
I believed one thing,
and I was torn.
I-I always had this in the back
of my mind that, you know,
something's really
not right here.
And, uh, I really had
to know... know the truth.
I had to feel it.
And...
last night made me feel it.
And it wasn't nothing
like I thought.
- Last night was the first time
I've ever heard Bob think that...
Out loud, think
that they might be innocent.
But in my mind, since
they had been pardoned,
I had come to the conclusion
that they were probably
innocent,
but nobody else in the family
had ever voiced that.
And I was on the outside
looking in, really.
I was a daughter-in-law.
So then when... after last night
when Bob was, you know, saying,
"Hey, they could be innocent,"
I finally was able to, you know,
talk with him more about it.
- The person I really,
really feel sorry for
is the White family
'cause he's the only one
that said that he was innocent.
He didn't deserve what he got.
His family
didn't deserve what they got.
- What do you think?
- I don't know.
It's up to you, Bob.
Come on in.
- You made it.
I made it.
- Thankfully.
My name's Bob.
- I'm Lois.
- Nice to meet you, Lois.
- Nice to meet you.
- Hi, Bob.
- Hi. You're?
- Nancy.
- Nancy.
Nice to meet you, Nancy.
Want to have
a seat at the table?
- All right.
- Tell me about your son
a little bit, could you?
- Well, he was a typical
teenager growing up.
And he was always
kind of a mama's boy.
He was always laughing
about something.
He was my clown.
- Yeah.
I did see him at the trial.
And he seemed like he was
a pretty confident
and composed-type person.
- Joseph had enough
self-confidence
for a room full of people.
When we were growing up,
faith in yourself,
believe in yourself.
It's where you have to start.
- That's kind of the impression
I got from last night.
It made me think
quite a bit, you know.
All those years, we've been
told one thing, you know,
and, uh...
you really don't
know any different, you know?
And when you go through
such a loss like we did...
it was...
- That was terrible.
- It was pretty tragic for us
because she was
the hub of our family.
She... yeah.
I've always believed
that God has
a strange way of doing things.
But there's some lessons
to be learned here somewhere.
You know? And...
mine is really not
to prejudge people
without really knowing
what's really going on.
Now, I thought
I was always that way,
but I guess I wasn't.
I really, really feel sorry
for what you guys went through.
I really...
It's not fair to anybody.
It's not fair to any of us.
- Yep.
- We'll heal.
- Yeah, and I'm glad
that I could be a part
of your healing.
- Thank you.
I'm glad you're part of mine.
- Shane's calling.
- Hi, Shane.
Man, I haven't slept
for two nights.
I been awake for two days
'cause I can't sleep.
I was so worried about
how you would feel about...
You guys would feel about
how the way I feel about it now.
I really wish you could
have been here for this...
- It would have opened up
your eyes.
And it might have made you think
a little more about things,
because it did me.
And, you know, Shane,
I'm not thinking
like I used to think.
- Mom and Dad...
- It's hard to digest
that they weren't there,
that this was all made up.
That, in their minds,
they started believing it.
And it comes from their dreams.
- What I found with me was,
I put it in my mind
the way I wanted
to put it in my mind.
You know,
I twisted things around
that would fit my conclusion...
I don't know how to put it...
To satisfy your own
need for closure.
- You know?
And...
- It was just
a lot of mistakes made.
And a lot of strange
things happened
that don't make sense.
- And very gullible people
that could be talked
into doing anything.
- Doing anything.
That's... and that's the problem.
You know?
- And the only one
they couldn't talk
to do anything was Joseph White.
- Yeah.
- And he stood his ground.
- Joseph White's
mother and sister,
'cause they were at the play,
they came over to our house.
And we sat at the table.
And we talked for, what,
2 1/2 hours, 2 hours?
And we had a really nice talk.
And she... they're
really nice people, Shane.
She's a sweet lady.
His mom's a sweet lady.
I really liked her a lot.
- And she...
You know, she was hurt.
She said, I lost my
son for 18 years, and then...
For however long it was...
And then he come home.
And then he got killed.
And, man... you know?
No.
- No.
- I'm sorry, bud.
I thought I had to tell you that
because I thought
you needed to know.
I didn't want you to hear it
from somebody else.
You know what I'm saying?
No.
- That's not what we're saying.
We still feel the same
about Burt as we did before.
- Yeah, nothing will change
our feelings about Burt.
He was just doing his job.
- Yeah.
- Our kids, Cody,
Ashley, and Britney,
they went to the play.
Ashley, she thought
that it showed
a lot of sympathy,
empathy for the Beatrice Six.
She was surprised that there
was some profanity in it
'cause the actor that played
Burt said, "Bullshit!"
More than that.
I had... when I was questioning
Tom Winslow
in the one interview, I said,
"Well, you butt fucked her,
didn't you?"
You know?
- Oh!
- And she was surprised.
- Oh, that's what it was!
- She was surprised
that that was...
- Yes, that's what it was.
And I can't believe
she said it out loud
in front of my grandchildren,
but she did.
And we really wanted
to attend it,
but Burt was playing
in a golf tournament
that went past our time.
- I had committed to that
well in advance.
- Yeah, and I didn't
want to go alone,
and I had already agreed
to watch
the children on Sunday.
So that's why we did
not get to see it.
- I would like to hope
that people somewhat get
a little bit of, uh...
More knowledge about what
and how everything was done
back in the '80s
and understand
that what was done
was done technically
and pretty much done correctly
as it should have been.
And there was a lot of things,
you know, that I think show
that they were just as
guilty in the situation
as there's a lot of things
that people might want
to think show them innocent.
- I understand that.
I'm saying I can understand
how the court and a jury
decided that,
but I think there was
a lot of factual basis and...
That show both sides.
I know that you're sitting
over here saying, well,
you know, he didn't give me
the answer I wanted.
I can't. Okay?
And the reason I can't,
I can't say something
I fully don't believe.
- I don't believe
they're innocent.
I've already told you that.
I only accept
what I know happened,
what I seen happen,
and I can't make it change.
Is that fair?
Yep.
- Are we done?
- Okay.
You know, I don't know
how else to answer,
because here's the deal,
will I accept the civil trial's
jury verdict?
Yes. I will.
I have to.
- You have to understand...
Okay, he's still filming.
You've gotta shut
that thing off!
- So I'll say something to you.
So when you're coming
after me to want me to say
certain things
and you're pushing on me...
Okay, I'm just telling you
my feeling at the time.
I'm going to put my shell on.
- I don't know.
Give me time.
- Give me time.
Will I sit there and say,
"Oh my God,
I know we did wrong, and all
that, and I can't help it?"
No, I'm not.
I'm not gonna do it.
I did my job
to the best of my ability.
My job is not to make you happy
because that's
what you want me to say.
I'm not going to say that.
That ain't my job.
My job was to do,
collect, gather,
give it to someone else,
and they determined that.
That's all I did.
- I just told you, I'll accept.
- I'll accept it.
I don't have to agree with it.
That's as... that's all I know.
How's that?
I'm not gonna tell you
they're innocent,
'cause I can't prove
that either.
I will tell you, I'll accept
the verdict of the court
that they are innocent.
And I know there was a lot
of mistakes made that I know.
There's a lot of things
I don't know.
- Yeah.
- I feel better
that he said that.
You know, just getting you
to say it is tough.
- Exactly.
- Yeah.
Been carrying this
around for so long
that it's just consumed
our lives.
Hope that he'd open
his mind up a little bit more
to possibility that
something else happened
than what he imagined
and what he believed.
I've always hoped that he
would consider the possibility
that maybe they were innocent.
If he can accept that,
then maybe the family,
and his friends,
and others can accept that.
And then we can all
move on from this
and... and let it go.
- How are you?
Behaving?
- Hey, kiddo.
- Hey.
How's it going?
- I'm good.
How are you?
- Good.
- So good morning to all of you.
Thank you.
This is gonna be hard.
Thank you so much
for being here.
We are here today
to find closure
and live
the rest of our lives thinking
about who Grandma was
and who she made us.
We're planting a tree into
the ground and giving it life.
This is Grandma's life to
live on, in my opinion.
That's what this means to me.
The branches are Bob,
and John, and Jan,
and Stanley, and Tad, and
Mark, and Nicole, all of us.
Today is about who she was,
not what happened.
If anybody would like to
come and grab some dirt
and put some dirt
around the hole,
you're welcome to do that
before we finish planting
this thing.
So help yourself up here
if you'd like to do that.
- Do you want a shovel?
- Nope.
I'm gonna do it just like this.
- Thank you, Burt.
- Thank you, Burt.
- I called Burt
to personally invite him here
to the dedication.
He's been made out to be
the villain in all of this,
and Burt is not a villain.
I do believe that he did his job
and he arrested the people
that he thought did it.
- Oh, you're pushing
me in a direction
I don't really want to go.
I'm not prepared
to hang Burt out.
I'm still not willing to believe
that the Beatrice Six
didn't know about it.
They possibly knew
Bruce Allen Smith,
and he may or may not have
told them what he did.
That's where my beliefs are
right now.
- We know the truth now.
It was proven
without a shadow of a doubt.
I just think people need to...
open up their hearts
and minds to it
so they can understand,
really, what it was.
Not just the ending, not just
the beginning, not the middle.
Just what the whole thing
caused from start to finish.
- Everybody's like,
"Well, isn't it nice
that it's over?"
As long as I live in this state,
someone will bring this up.
That will be my life.
But I keep the screaming
to a minimum.
I keep the crying to a minimum.
That's the best I can do,
Because we got hurt.
All of us got hurt.
- If you want my opinion,
I feel bad for Gage County.
Not bad enough I'ma
tell them not to pay me money,
you know?
But they're paying for something
somebody else did,
just like we did.
I feel really bad
for the family.
The Sheriff's Department
at Gage County
not only brainwashed us,
but they brainwashed them, too.
- You know, it's so hard
when you believed
a story for 35 years...
and then you're being told, no,
you don't believe that anymore
'cause that's not true.
I know enough to know
that they didn't do
anything to Grandma.
The rest of it,
I'm sure I will end up with
they had zero to do
with any of this.
But my brain just
isn't quite there yet.
I don't think anyone's brain
is equipped
to just flip
the switch like that.
It takes time.
- I went through a lot of drama,
an ordeal that I never expected
to go through.
I tell everybody,
if I knew now what I know then,
I would have changed a lot
of things, a lot of things.
- Deb isn't, to this day,
quite sure just what happened.
- She still feels
she was involved.
That's how bad
they brainwashed her.
Sad, but true.
- We all live with this
feeling helpless and confused.
But Deb...
Deb's on a deeper level
with living with it.
- Took me a long time,
but I realized I wasn't there.
I realized none of it,
none of it was true.
I know I'm not guilty,
and I know I've been
all done with that.
But I remember going
to the apartment, yeah.
Like I said, I never saw
a dead person
in my entire life
till that... till that time.
'Cause I see it in my dreams.