30 for 30 (2009–…): Season 3, Episode 38 - Lance Part 2 - full transcript
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Do you feel like you want to
be relevant again?
Um...
This is going to sound terrible.
But I am relevant.
I am.
[ Chuckles ] I mean,
it just, it's -- and I get --
look, I know that every headline
starts with the word
"disgraced," or "disgraceful,"
or some version of that word
"disgrace."
Look, the story is so
polarizing, and it's just --
you're never -- it will always
be that way.
And I know that.
And so I don't -- by knowing it,
I don't expect it to change.
I don't want it to change.
I'm not trying to will it
to change.
It's...
It's complicated.
[ Crowd cheering ]
Welcome to the show, Lance.
Thanks a lot.
Congratulations.
The event completed less than a
week ago, right?
On Sunday is the final ride
right back into the heart of
Paris?
Is that what it is?
That's right.
So, what has your life been
like since then?
Just nuts I guess, huh?
Just nuts.
Yeah.
Just basically nuts.
The Tour De France has fallen
on hard times for some reason.
It's gotten a bad reputation
because of drug taking,
enhancement drug, performance
drugs, blood doping, all of that
kind of stuff.
And yet, you come in, a man
literally, clearly at death's
door, and you dominate the
event.
It's just an amazing thing.
And the press over there, those
idiots.
[ Laughter ]
No, but I'm serious.
They wouldn't leave you alone,
would they?
They suggested that, "Well, you
know, maybe there's something
about his disorder that actually
makes him a better bicycler."
Yeah.
Well, that's just crap, isn't
it?
Performance enhancing
chemotherapy.
[ Cheers and applause ]
You and your wife are
expecting a baby?
That's right.
How soon will that happen?
End of October.
End of October, a baby.
You know yet?
A boy or girl, you know?
No, we don't know.
Okay, good for you.
That's a great story, as well.
And here, you know, here in
New York we have the --
1999 surprised everybody.
Nobody -- nobody expected that,
ourselves included.
It just hockey sticked
everything.
Yeah, zero to 60 real fast.
Back here in France, there
are still some who claim that
Lance Armstrong's '99
Tour De France victory was due
in part to the fact that
Jan Ullrich, the '97 champion,
and Marco Pantani the
'98 champion, weren't here last
year.
There were years where we all
knew Lance would be
unchallenged, basically.
And Jan was one of the few
riders in the conversation that
could possibly beat him.
There was always this very
high level of respect between
the two of us.
And he was very different.
I mean, the other guys that were
"rivals," I didn't like them.
And I didn't want to like them.
And it was better for me
not to like them.
I thought. [ Chuckles ]
I see these guys now, they're
like...shaking hands,
being nice to each other.
I'm like, "You wimps.
What are you doing?"
Jesus. Get your hate on, man.
Anyway, so with him, it was just
we were very respectful of each
other.
It was a great contrast.
People even talked about a cold
war, the American against the
East German.
Jan Ullrich's upbringing, one
could say, was fairly similar
to Lance Armstrong's in the
sense that they both came from a
broken home.
Armstrong's father left the
family pretty early.
And Ullrich's did, as well.
He grew up in the former GDR.
East German didn't have anything
to be proud of except for their
sports.
They got selected at the age of
13, according to how they
performed.
People got used to
East German athletes in
particular being these
incredible robotic figures,
that had fallen off a production
line somewhere behind the
Iron Curtain.
He was much more Mediterranean
really.
He was very emotional.
He was someone who struggled
to live the life of a
professional cyclist for 365
days a year.
And it was a shame because his
talent was one of the greatest
talents that professional
cycling had ever seen.
The balance of power was really
established in that first 2000
Tour, and it never really
changed.
And in fact, as time when by,
Armstrong's superiority complex
increased and Ullrich's
inferiority complex developed.
That was really the story
of the rest of his career.
He became a perennial nearly
man, Lance Armstrong's whipping
boy.
Other than that one Tour
in 2003 where he had him by a
minute going into the last time
trial.
And then it rained in Nantes.
And Ullrich crashed.
And as he was going down,
sliding through the roundabout,
I thought, "Okay, that's the
closest anyone's going to come
to Lance.
[ Cheering ]
Lance, as we've mentioned,
you've been on this tour,
coast to coast now.
But one of the big reasons is
you have your book out,
"It's Not About the Bike."
And I went in the book store
last night, and it's, you know,
they'd sold out of the thing.
How does it feel to be a best
selling author?
It's been an amazing
few years.
People like to pick apart the
book.
But the book was...
everything in that book was
true, except for when I say or
address doping, you know, and
take a position against it and
take a position against the
people who are accusing me of
it.
Everything else is true.
I had no idea how
inspirational that book would
become, regardless of any
athletic achievement.
What it meant for so many people
that got sick with cancer, that
read that book, that were
inspired to fight.
As Lance started being more,
you know, getting more famous
and winning more Tours, there
was a lot riding on that.
He's about to become only the
fifth rider in the 98-year
history of the Tour De France
to win this race three
consecutive times.
Because he's an inspiration
to people everywhere, we chose
Tour De France winner
Lance Armstrong as the most
fascinating person.
He's used his fame to spread
his message of hope.
Hey, everybody.
"The obligation of the cure,"
he calls it.
A young athlete gets asked
by Wheaties to be on the box,
I was almost stunned.
I thought that that would never
happen to me.
There was the team that he
was supporting, a sport that he
was building.
Companies that were growing.
And this was like, he had this
on his shoulder.
It is a money machine story.
There is no doubt.
And that's what I always said.
I said, "Hey, it's
Lance Armstrong Incorporated
now.
And then there's Livestrong that
sits over here completely
separate, that is doing what it
can to fight cancer.
It wasn't like all of a
sudden, "Hey, guys, just FYI,
I've been doping."
Like, that's just not going to
happen, right?
I was like, "I can never be
honest about this."
Because all of this momentum
and profitability and goodness
will come crashing down.
2001, we have 9/11.
Lance Armstrong's won three
Tour De Frances.
Goes and wins another one.
All the praise that we put
upon him was all well deserved.
I was never a teammate with
Lance, but my friends were.
And I asked them, how much of
this is mythology, and how much
is it real?
And they would universally say
"No, he's a bad ass."
Oh, and Beloki's gone down.
Armstrong's off the road, as
well.
Armstrong complete control
there.
He's into the field, but what a
great bike rider.
He's gone across.
This is unbelievable.
I've never seen this before.
Armstrong went across the field,
there.
He's back on the road at 4
kilometers to go.
I was in the press room when
that happened, and even
reporters who absolutely could
not stand the man gasped.
Like...[ Gasps ]
Did that just happen?
I've watched that footage a
thousand times.
I still can't believe that he
didn't fall down.
Right here.
Yeah!
It's just amazing to see
somebody who's an athlete of
that caliber, who's been through
what he's been, to come back and
conquer the world of cycling.
[ Applause ]
There was a point in Lance's
life where he could pick the
phone up and call anybody he
wanted.
So there was all this
discussion, right?
Is he going to run for Governor?
Is he going to run for Senator?
He just became, you know,
a global figure.
And for somebody like me, this
was like, you know, the
sculpture of David.
You know, it was sort of
perfectly carved already.
He was a great leader at that
foundation.
You know, he did there what he
did on the bike.
I mean, he was just driven,
passionate, demanded excellence.
You know, was deeply involved.
I think there is this segment
of the population that thinks,
you know, you were doping in
cycling, and you were being
mean to people.
And somebody said, "Dude, you
better start doing something
good," and so then you created
the organization to cover that
up.
[ Camera shutters clicking ]
I never was paid by Livestrong,
and I never was going to be paid
by Livestrong.
Lance was adamant that his
corporate partners support the
organization in a very
significant way.
And he, in several
circumstances, bypassed what
could have been personal income
and said, "No, I want that
directed to the organization."
And Nike was the biggest example
of that.
When Nike came to me with
this idea of making 5 million
yellow wrist bands, selling them
for a dollar a piece, helping us
raise 5 million bucks at
Livestrong...
Um...[ Chuckles ]
I was like, "Wait, what?
That will never work."
[ Cheers and applause ]
Listen up, everybody.
America is wrapping its
wrists in yellow.
The yellow wristbands showed
that people wanted to be a part
of something bigger.
Riders in the Tour wore them.
The Olympics in Athens were a
month later, and Nike gave them
out to all their athletes at the
Olympics.
You had a presidential campaign
later that year where John Kerry
wore it every day.
We sold, you know, 20 million
the first four or five months,
and I think there was over
80 million sold, you know, over
the period of time that we were
selling them.
It was a way for people not only
to relate to, you know, one of
the most tragic diseases that
humanity has seen, but also be
part of the story.
It changed the foundation
forever because it brought
tremendous resources, tremendous
attention, international
attention, and with that, just
unlimited opportunity for new
programing and the ability
to impact more lives.
Before the Lance Armstrong
Foundation, what it was like to
have cancer was totally
different.
It was much more private and
much more isolated.
Lance removed the stigma of
being a young adult with cancer.
It wasn't something to be
ashamed of or embarrassed about.
It almost put you in like the
cool kids club of, "Yeah, I
have cancer, watch out.
I'm tough, I'm a survivor."
Young adults with cancer.
Those issues are totally
different than little kids with
cancer or old people with
cancer.
There wasn't a movement to bring
it all together.
We wanted to fix all that.
How do we make a difference?
How do we demand change?
How do we ask leadership --
I spent probably the better
part of a year going around
to his cancer events, to see for
myself what was going on there.
One of his stops was at a
children's hospital to see young
cancer patients.
And he would not allow me to go
in the rooms with him.
He was like, "No, this is not a
media event.
I'm doing this for these kids."
Alright, if you want to be
totally cynical and tell me that
was for show, but I don't think
so.
I don't think so.
I'm not saying that makes
anything else that he did okay.
But I'm not willing to say that
there was not a sincere molecule
in his body.
I've seen him be the last guy
to see people.
The last guy.
He would come out, and he would
be a...wreck.
A wreck.
Getting cancer is a really...
scary thing.
And, man, when you emerge from
the other end and you're not
dead, it's pretty cool.
And you wanted other people to
realize that you've got hope
in your life.
And frankly, he had the
resources to turn that into
something that benefited a lot
of people.
But if it wasn't a cynical tool
from the start, I think towards
the middle and on, I think it
was.
I mean, we used to refer to it
as "the cancer shield."
It certainly was an influence
in the way people thought about
him and their unwillingness to
believe that it could even be
possible that he was doping.
It is unfair to say that I
used Livestrong as a shield.
That's -- the organization was
too legitimate.
We did too many good things and
too much good work.
Now, I do think, and it's, I'll
admit, I mean, I used cancer
occasionally as a shield, which
is just...stupid.
I came out of a life threatening
disease.
I was on my death bed.
You think I'm going to come back
into a sport and say, "Okay,
okay, Doctor, give me everything
you got, I just want to go
fast."
No way.
A guy who comes back from
arguably, you know, a death
sentence, why would I then enter
into a sport and dope myself up
and risk my life again?
That's crazy.
I would never do that.
That's -- no. No way.
In hindsight, cycling and cancer
should have been kept separate.
Lance's impact on the world
of cancer doesn't excuse the
doping.
Equally as important, doping
doesn't erase his impact on the
world of cancer.
And I feel like everyone wants
to lump them together and throw
them all out because everyone
wants it to be black and white.
But the truth is, it's gray.
I truly believe if you are
diagnosed with cancer in America
today, you're experience is
better than it was pre-Lance
and pre-Livestrong.
Irrefutably better.
I had cancer at 22 and again at
24.
I was a healthy young adult.
I ran a marathon the day before
I was diagnosed.
Cancer treatments like
chemotherapy and radiation can
cause infertility.
Or cancer treatments can be
sterilizing.
But most doctors at the time
weren't forthcoming with that
information.
My own doctor was going through
all the side effects of
chemotherapy and didn't mention
fertility.
In the waiting room was a
magazine with the story about
Lance and Kristen and how they
had just had a bouncing baby boy
because Lance had banked his
sperm and they had done
fertility treatments.
And so here I was a young adult
cancer patient, and I didn't
learn about my fertility risks
from the doctors at the top
cancer centers.
I learned about my fertility
risks from Lance.
[ Baby crying ]
He's such a little talker.
Unbelievable the way he was
conceived.
Give us a jump. Go jump.
To see him now, he's so normal
and perfect.
I still can't figure it out.
It was really sort of a taboo
subject that was kept in the
closet, and Lance was just open
about it.
I think I called Stamford five
or six times, and someone
answered the phone by mistake,
like, after hours, and said,
"Oh, we have a new egg freezing
program for cancer patients.
You would be one of the first,
come in tomorrow."
And two weeks later, my eggs
were frozen and I started
chemotherapy on time.
And today, I have four children.
At Fertile Hope, we started
the first ever financial
assistance program to help
cancer patients pay for
fertility treatments in that
short time frame.
That program still exists today
at Livestrong.
It has helped more than 10,000
patients and saved them more
than $50 million.
And there have been thousands
of babies born because of Lance
and Livestrong's work around
cancer survivorship.
[ Groans ]
Dude.
I'm Luke David Armstrong,
and I'm Lance's son.
I never really bring it up who I
am because I feel like that
would make me come off as
someone that I'm not.
I mean, it is part of who I am,
but at the end of the day, it's
not, like, what describes me.
There's so much more than that.
Would you ever take
performance enhancing drugs?
I mean, me specifically, I've
always felt like grinding for
something, and really, like,
working for a specific goal has
always been so much more worth
it than taking the short cut.
And I also feel that like if I
ever did that and got caught,
for random people, they would be
like, "He's just like his dad."
What's up with your chain out
there?
It rains.
You haven't ridden that bike
in --
Every day I ride it.
Well, the chain's way too
loose.
I know. It's kind of weird.
I have a week left.
I was going to bring it back.
And get it tuned up?
Yeah.
Good idea.
How would you feel if your
son told you that he wanted to
take performance enhancing
drugs?
If we were put in that
position where Luke, who's a
college football player came to
me and said either, "I'd like to
try this, or I am doing this,"
I would say, "That's a bad
idea.
I mean, you're a freshman in
college that's, you know --
it might be a different
conversation if you're in the
NFL.
But at this point in your life
and in your career, not worth
it."
[ Applause ]
Well, thanks, boys.
Hopefully -- I'm not a football
coach so hopefully I can project
enough.
But this idea of work and
process, quite honestly, that
was my favorite part of the
game.
Whether it's diet, sleep,
strength work, tactics, morale.
I mean, all of this minutiae,
the small things, truly, truly
matter.
And so, you know, I'm proud of
all you guys.
I'm obviously proud of number
48.
I think it was important that
I played football because it
wasn't cycling.
So I had my own path to, like,
be myself, to be Luke and not to
be Lance's son.
What do we say?
What do they say here at Rice?
Like, you know, what's the
battle cry?
Rice fight never dies.
Rice fight never dies.
So it's not like "woo woo."
[ Laughter ]
You say "Rice fight," and
they'll respond to you.
Rice fight --
Never dies!
Rice fight --
Never dies!
Man, alright, thanks, boys.
He'll be rocking.
Your mom's coming.
Yeah.
And your grandparents.
And I'm 35 for the scrimmage.
Not 48? Oh.
But that's easy to confuse.
You've worn 48 the whole spring.
I know, I know, I get it.
But he said 48, and I was like,
"Oh, no, I'm 35."
Okay.
Nice meeting you.
Love you.
Good to meet you.
Yeah. 35.
Mm-hmm.
He's out there.
Do you like the snow?
No, I don't love snow.
No, I -- I stop short of hating
snow, but I'm not a big fan.
There was a lot of reasons to
make the move for now.
Quite frankly, you know,
settling the Postal case I think
it was a good thing.
But it still cost $6.5 million.
So, you know, just at this point
in my life, until a few things
significant happen on the
financial side, it was just
easier to sell the home in
Austin, take the proceeds, and
just get that thing out of my
life.
Oh.
Ah!
What is this?!
[ Chuckles ]
Oh, my gosh!
Olivia, do you want to come
with me?
No, I want to go by myself,
I just want to real quick.
Okay. Alright.
You want to race me?
[ Laughter ]
Aaah! I can't steer!
[ Laughs ]
Watch out! Watch out!
Don't crash into me!
[ Screams ]
Hey, could be worse.
I could be Floyd Landis.
What, living in Leadville?
Waking up a piece of...every
day.
Is that what you think?
Yeah. Yeah.
That's what I know.
I don't think it. I know it.
I hope he's changed, and I
hope he's finding some peace.
I don't know why people can't
move on, but here we are.
I grew up in Lancaster County,
Pennsylvania, in the Mennonite
Church.
It had some beliefs that are
unique to their way of life.
I got interested in cycling as a
kid in high school, and my
parents were not particularly
enthusiastic about my obsession
with it.
It took them a while to accept
it.
For me it was a way to go make
sense of the world.
At the time that I got hired by
the Postal Service team, they
had already won the
Tour De France three times with
Armstrong, and so he was about
as big a star as you could be at
that point.
That part made it easier for
Armstrong to control this group
of guys.
He was the boss, and there was
no ambiguity there.
They said that you were the
loud kind of outspoken guy on
the team.
Where does that come from?
Uh...[ Chuckles ]
I don't necessarily like to be
described as loud.
But I guess occasionally I speak
my opinion more than others.
Floyd was a former teammate
of mine, a beloved teammate of
mine.
I loved racing with Floyd.
He's a lot of fun.
Floyd is an interesting
character.
He doesn't play by the rules
that everybody plays by.
He's a free spirit.
And I had my own challenges that
I saw Floyd go through.
I was on a team that went
bankrupt midway through the
year, with Floyd.
And I saw what happened when he
felt cornered and didn't have
options.
I've had to work a little
harder than some people.
I haven't had as many breaks in
this sport.
And it's been 10 years getting
to this team and to the top
level and to be able to race
with Lance in the
Tour De France.
And I've had to fight my way
here so I don't really like to
put up with, you know, petty
little, what do you call them?
Traditions maybe.
[ Chuckles ]
Despite the difficulty of it
and the amount of time and
determination it takes, the
personalities are not
particularly aggressive.
They're often really introverted
people who just like to spend
time riding a bike by themselves
a lot or near other people
without saying anything.
What people see, they see
George Hincapie and think, "Oh,
he's a tough guy."
He's not. He just isn't.
I mean, Lance is.
Lance is a tough, hard...
But the rest of them were not.
And so they'll just take
whatever beatings they get and
smile.
If you were going to be on
Lance's team, you were there to
work for him.
And one by one, those guys
started getting frustrated with
that, wanted the respect,
wanted the higher contracts,
which is just normal.
And one by one, they'd leave.
What do you think?
I helped Lance win his first
three Tours, so I could look
back three years and look ahead
three years and see myself in
the exact same position, doing
the exact same thing.
And I never wanted to look back
at the end of my career and say,
"You know, I wish I had done
that."
You know, a lot of people told
me like, "Hey, you know, you
have the talent to compete in a
race like the Tour."
So I thought I should give it a
shot.
When we were teammates, we were
friends, and then not so
friendly anymore after we parted
ways.
Or I after I left the team.
He wanted to go to another
team and be a team leader and
try to win the Tour, and he's
going to win the Tour.
And you don't want that guy
on your team.
You have a guy on the team that
thinks he can win the Tour?
No!
There's the door.
In 2004, kind of a warm up
race for the Tour De France
called the Dauphin?.
I beat him in this time trial up
Mount Ventoux.
And, you know, I've heard from
sources that he was pissed.
And he called the UCI.
This is what I was told.
And said, "You got to get this
guy."
And sure enough, they called
that night.
So I don't know.
It most likely happened.
If I had to guess one way or the
other, I'd guess yes, that he
had something to do with, you
know, me getting caught.
I think it would be difficult
to overstate the power that
Lance had in the American
cycling industry, in the sport
of cycling for America, and even
globally to everybody involved
in the sport of cycling.
He was unbelievably powerful.
Let's talk about
Lance Armstrong.
What are his greatest strengths
as a rider?
I think Lance is incredibly
determined.
I mean, I think he has a great
tactical sense.
I think he has...
He's got a fire in his belly to
succeed.
I idolized Greg LeMond.
When he won the Tour De France
in 1989 in such dramatic
fashion, I mean, it's the
greatest Tour De France victory
of all time.
And I say that now, and I mean
it.
Greg LeMond is the fastest
man at all the intermediate
checks, over all the 136
cyclists who have gone before
him.
LeMond's time represented an
average speed of 34 miles an
hour.
No Tour De France time trial has
ever been quicker.
Nothing's even close.
I mean, for me, it was super
inspiring to see that, and that
was when I was transitioning
from triathlon to cycling.
So it was perfect time for me.
[ Cheers and applause ]
There was no denying he was a
bad ass bike racer.
I mean, one of the best ever.
He was supportive the first
couple years.
Then the Ferrari relationship
was made public.
Greg LeMond made some comments
that this is either an amazing
story or he's the biggest fraud
in the history of --
You know, pretty harsh things.
I didn't say he's taking
anything.
That's his interpretation of
what I was saying.
I got a phone call from Lance.
He just said, "You know, I
thought we were friends."
I thought we were friends.
And he said, "Well, if you want
to throw stones, I can throw
stones."
The extent of the "bullying"
with Greg, which is all true,
is we were both under this Trek
family, Trek Bikes family.
I was riding Treks.
He had his line at Trek, his own
LeMond line.
And he was becoming more and
more vocal.
LeMond had a bike company
that was part of Trek, which was
Lance's big sponsor.
And Lance used his muscle, his
influence to, in a lot of ways,
ruin LeMond's business.
In how you treated people,
what is the worst thing that you
did?
What is the worst thing?
Everybody in the world needs to
get this question.
What is the worst thing you've
ever done?
Don't deflect.
No, no, no, I'm thinking.
I'm going to answer your
question.
You can think in silence.
Well, cut that out.
You don't need to use that part.
I mean, Jesus, edit.
Probably the way I treated and
spoke about Emma O'Reilly.
That's probably the worst.
I was a soigneur.
Somebody who looks after riders.
I kind of thought if I ever did
want to speak out, it was to do
good.
My whole thing really was about
the UCI.
It's them that are creating this
problem.
It annoyed me that the whole
system was set up not to protect
the riders.
You know, that the riders were
just fodder for other peoples
grand plans.
David Walsh got in touch with
me.
And I thought, you know, he
could make this a helpful,
constructive article about the
problems in cycling.
I was feeling really guilty.
And that's stayed with me for a
long time.
Over being disloyal to my
teammates and to the riders.
Then Pantani died.
Pantani died of an overdose,
but a lot of people say he died
of a broken heart, you know?
Coincidentally dying on
Valentine's Day of all days.
Pantani was an unusual folk
hero.
He used to put on these
incredible shows in the
mountains.
Marco Pantani's moved up to
first.
Pantani's gone over the line in
first place.
Phil, that is unbelievable.
Italy became captivated by
Pantani because to them, he
personified the underdog.
And the Italians always felt
like underdogs.
After 1999, having been
associated with doping, he
almost couldn't face himself,
let alone the world.
The country of Italy
discarded him -- one of their
sporting heroes, who did
everything that everybody else
did.
They discarded.
You grow up being told, you
know, particularly when you're
as a talented athlete like that,
you know, that people are going
to adore you and people are
going to applaud your every
move.
And then you suddenly realize
that your reputation's shot
and you don't have that anymore.
I think that's got to be hard
for anybody.
I think one of the tragedies
of that lost generation of
riders is that the ones who felt
the shame most keenly on their
conscience were maybe the ones
who suffered the most.
And I think that was certainly
the case with Pantani.
Sometimes you've got to stand
up and be counted.
And that's what I said to David.
"Okay, you can use whatever you
want.
I can back up everything I
said."
When David said he couldn't put
in about the UCI and about the
doctors and stuff, I knew I was
in trouble.
I realized it was going to be
more about Lance than cycling.
So now I was left to Lance's
wrath on my own.
We have instigated a lot of
action here.
Every accusation that's come,
every case that's come, we've
sued people, we've opened
ourselves up for investigation,
we've opened ourself up for
inquiries.
And our average, our batting
average in all of them is 1,000.
Do you have any other
evidence to suggest that
Ms. O'Reilly was making up this
in exchange for money other than
the fact that she received some
compensation?
Emma or Steven?
Emma.
Oh, sorry.
Pissed.
Pissed at me, pissed at Johan.
Really pissed at Johan.
Pissed at the team.
Afraid that we were going to out
her as a...
the thing she said, as a...or
whatever, I don't know.
To call a woman a...is just
totally unacceptable.
Um...
That would be...
It's hard to be worse than that.
So why did you do it?
Um...
Well, you know, I had a version
of events in my head that I --
I wasn't trying to say that she
was a...but...
Um...well, why did I do it?
Because I was an idiot and in
full attack mode.
That's why I did it, right?
I would have said anything.
I couldn't be a different person
off the bike.
There was no getting in my way,
and it worked really, really
good for training and racing.
Perfect for that.
It just doesn't work good when
you're dealing with another
human being who's not in the
race.
Paris today opened it's heart
to Texan, Lance Armstrong, who
now is the first cyclist to win
the grueling Tour De France six
times in a row.
[ Cheers and applause ]
It's a great feeling.
Especially nowadays.
Every year, more and more
Americans come here on the
Champs-Elys?es.
And now it's just lined with
Americans, American flags, Texas
flags.
And almost feel like I'm at home
standing up there.
2004 is when the mess
started, where they were
breathing down our throats to
sign a false affidavit
supporting Lance, smearing
David Walsh.
When I refused to do that, it
was just a snowball.
Anybody Lance could talk to, to
smear me, to cast aspersions on
my character, because he wanted
to portray me as some sort of
whacko that you don't want to
believe her.
It was all about protecting the
brand.
Lance Inc.
"Cancer survivor."
If you were not on side with
the secret, Lance would just
cease speaking positively of
you.
Which you say, "Well, that's no
big deal."
But when you're trying to be,
you know, a television announcer
for cycling, like Frankie was,
and the largest star in the
sport is Lance Armstrong and,
you know, the producer of the
show asks him, "Who do you think
would be a good announcer?"
And he says, "Oh, well, you
know, this guy and this guy."
And then, "What about Frankie?"
"Ah, mm."
He's very good at making sure
he's one step removed from true
responsibility of his actions.
You understand that although
we're in the conference room
of your lawyers, you are giving
testimony as if you are in a
court of law.
Do you understand that?
Correct.
The team at the time, managed by
Thom Weisel, didn't have the
money to pay me.
So they insured all of my
bonuses, all of my salary
raises, increases, everything.
They decided, if this guy's
defrauding us and he's cheating
to win these races, they didn't
want to pay the prize money.
And so Lance filed suit against
SCA Promotions, trying to
collect his prize money.
Betsy Andreu went under oath,
Frankie Andreu went under oath.
They said he admitted to doping
in 1996.
Lance denied it.
Tell us what was said during
this conversation in the
Indiana University Hospital
rooms.
Lance was diagnosed with
cancer, so Frankie and I went to
go visit him.
And we were in his hospital
room, but then he was going to
have a consultation with the
doctors, so I said, "I think we
should leave to give you your
privacy."
And Lance said, "That's okay,
you can stay."
The doctor asked him a couple of
questions.
And then came the question,
"Have you ever taken any
performance enhancing drugs?"
And he just nonchalantly rattled
them off.
EPO, testosterone, growth
hormones, steroids, cortisone.
But I just want to make sure.
It's not that you don't remember
whether that the
Indiana Hospital room incident
occurred.
It affirmatively did not take
place?
No, it didn't.
How could it have taken place
when I've never taken
performance enhancing drugs?
How could that have happened?
That was my point.
It's not just simply you don't
recall.
How many times do I have to
say it?
I'm just trying to make sure
your testimony is clear.
Well, if it can be any
clearer, then I've never taken
drugs.
Then incidents like that could
never have happened.
Okay.
How clear is that?
Based on those lies, that
forced the company to settle
with Lance Armstrong and pay him
$7.5 million.
Nobody dopes and is honest.
You're not.
The only way you can dope and be
honest is if nobody ever asks
you, which is not realistic.
The second somebody asks you...
you lie.
Now, might be one lie because
you answer it once.
Or in my case, it might be
10,000 lies because you answer
it 10,000 times.
And then you take it a step
further, and you reinforce it.
And, "Hey...you, don't ever...
ask me that question again."
Right?
And then you go sue somebody,
that's another -- and then it
just -- so that's why it was
100 times worse.
Because we all lied.
The most irrational thing
I've ever seen him do was in
2004 when he decided to chase
down this Italian rider,
Filippo Simeoni.
Simeoni had testified against
Michele Ferrari.
Ferrari was Lance's coach for
all seven of those Tours that he
won.
Lance chased him down,
vindictively sat behind him
mocking him.
When eventually Simeoni
came back to the Peloton,
Lance comes up to the camera
and does...
I mean, you cannot get anymore
fundamentally evil than that.
The God damn thing about it,
though, is it was on
international television.
It was horrible and should have
been embarrassing to
Lance Armstrong.
But he was at a point in his
life where he was getting away
with stuff.
I think Simeoni has done
a tremendous injustice to his
sport and to the people that pay
his bills.
When you're that protected by
the organization that runs
cycling, I mean, you can
actually take out personal
vendettas as well as win at the
same time, and he liked that.
That was his thing.
Filippo Simeoni is right up
there with Emma.
To stoop to that level, that's
not what a champion does.
So I needed to go say sorry
for that.
I went there in 2013, so it had
been nine years.
He said, "For nine years, my
entire life is associated with
you."
This is a guy that was a
multiple time Italian champion
at one stage.
I mean, he'd won some races.
But everybody remembered that
day because I was a...
So it just takes, you know,
those days and hearing those
things to learn and to be like,
"Okay, what you thought was bad
was way worse."
Let's welcome Lance Armstrong
and Johan Bruyneel.
[ Applause ]
I will cut right to the chase
and say that after a lot of
thought, I've decided that the
Tour De France will be my last
race as a professional cyclist.
It will be the last one, win or
lose.
The biggest inspiration in my
life now and the biggest
inspiration in this decision is
my children.
Ultimately athletes have to
retire.
You can't do it forever.
My time has come, and there are
many, many other things that I
need to do in life, so...
Lance Armstrong cruised down
the roads into Paris today to
claim his seventh victory in the
Tour De France.
It was an incredible seven
years for him.
I mean, God, look at today.
Four of his teammates crash
right in front of him, and he
still stays up.
I mean, it's incredible.
The guy -- just he's
unbreakable.
He's untouchable, and he's got
seven wins.
[ Laughs ]
Winning seven
Tour De Frances is not easy.
That's 21 stages times seven.
You need, you know, that's more
than a 100 straight days of not
crashing, getting sick, making a
strategic blunder, making sure
your team around you.
That's extremely difficult to do
that.
That takes a brilliant
competitive mind, a real
powerful leadership.
On the other hand, it's not
clear how well he would have
done if everybody was clean.
Lance Armstrong!
But that's what the world
was, and he succeeded in it.
The cynics and the skeptics,
I'm sorry for you.
I'm sorry you can't dream big.
And I'm sorry you don't believe
in miracles.
But this is one hell of a race.
This is a great sporting event,
and you should stand around and
believe.
You should believe in these
athletes --
When Lance Armstrong left the
Tour De France at the end of
2005, everything seemed to pale
into irrelevance.
He was the film star that
professional cycling had never
had.
He was the most charismatic
rider that professional cycling
had ever seen.
Lance Armstrong's win and
retirement mean many things, but
perhaps none more important than
this -- Americans will never
have to care about cycling
again.
[ Laughter ]
I think he was just enjoying
the retired life at that point.
He and McConaughey were working
out and just enjoying the beach.
McConaughey at that time was as
famous of an actor as you could
possibly get.
You walk into a bar or a
restaurant, and most of the
people there are like, "I want
to meet Matthew McConaughey.
I'm want to have a beer with
him."
Lance Armstrong was like a whole
different level of fame.
There was not a person in that
restaurant that didn't want to
shake his hand, not a bus boy
who wasn't affected by cancer.
Like, every single person wanted
to meet Lance Armstrong that
summer.
[ Cheering ]
Fans have decided the ESPY
goes to...
Lance Armstrong.
[ Cheers and applause ]
He was showing up at parties
that bike racers don't normally
go to.
Thank you, thank you, thank
you very much.
It has been amazing hosting
"Saturday Night Live" this week.
I would say it's been a tiring
week.
He was like the only "A" list
star in American cycling
history.
Did you meet any of your
dad's girlfriends?
Yeah. Sheryl.
She was super sweet.
He dated Tory Burch.
He dated Kate Hudson.
And Anna.
Yeah, he definitely dated
a few people before me.
Um...[ Laughs ]
I've been Lance's partner for
about 10 years now.
And we have two kids.
When Lance and I met, I was
actually living in Vail, working
with a small non profit, working
with young adult cancer
survivors.
So, yeah, something that kind
of drew us together I think was
our work in the cancer world.
[ Water bubbling ]
A little more Parmesan on
there, I think, honey.
Well, you could help out
with that, honey.
I'm going to put a few more
tomatoes on top.
How do you do that?
Have you ever peeled
a potato?
Uh, no.
Never done that.
Sad.
Guys, how did you meet?
[ Chuckles ]
Well...
[ Laughs ]
True story.
It was a snowy night in Denver.
This is not working.
That's the only part that's
true.
No, you did some nice --
you did a nice long crawl right
there.
Oh, look at that one.
And she was kind of coming on
to me at this bar.
And she chased me down the snowy
street.
And I was literally running.
This is not working.
Um...
No, you're doing great.
Okay, let's -- [ Gasps ]
Oh, no! Oh, my God.
[ Laughing ] Oh, my God.
That didn't work very good.
Oh, my God, there's blood all
over the place.
[ Laughs ]
I wonder how deep that is.
You got blood on my cheese.
Call some doctor friend of
ours.
Please, right now!
We have all these friends --
Why is this happening right
now?
No, call some doctor person
friend.
This is an emergency.
I'm actually getting a little
queasy.
I swear to God.
Hey, 911!
What's happening?
911. Doc, 911.
Here it is. Are you ready?
Right on the end.
Just the tip.
You know, I would just wrap
that thing pretty tight.
Just wrap it tight as...
Tight as...There you go.
Okay, alright.
Yeah, this isn't rocket
science, really.
Ugh!
Alright, let's wrap this...
up.
Stop it!
Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry,
sorry.
I think when you're wounded,
you can cuss without --
Max, I'm seriously injured,
bro.
Okay, well, fine.
Can I cuss?
Uh...
No.
Why are you taping it?
Okay, then you can't cuss.
I just wonder who's going to
have the bite of the salad with
my finger tip in it.
Ew, do you think it's in the
salad?
Yes.
[ Gasps ] Oh, my God!
We can't serve that.
That's disgusting.
How annoying is this finger,
Nick?
Should I put it down?
I'll put this hand up.
I need to elevate it.
My parents got divorced when
I was 1 years old, so I was a
little baby.
I never had to, like, deal with
it because I don't even remember
them being together.
Kristin and I divorced
in 2003, which was not pleasant.
The girls were still in diapers.
I will take
all of the responsibility
for saying, "I'm out."
You know, that was
my M.O. at the time, still is a
layer of that to me, where it's
like, "I'm out," you know.
And she didn't say "I'm out."
She wanted to figure it out.
And I just said, "no, I'm out."
Then I have this relationship
with Sheryl
that lasted for years.
Kristin's going,
"Wait a minute.
We just got divorced,
and now I'm reading in every
news outlet in the world
about my ex-husband,
the father of my three kids,
with this rock star."
It couldn't have been easy.
And the irony is
I wasn't that happy.
This is why I so do not miss
living with or loving
or being in a relationship
with anybody else famous, is in
those situations, you just can't
get out.
And then you're afraid.
You're afraid to break the
cycle, and you just stay in.
And I did it.
I did it way too long.
I should have just said, "No,
I can't do this anymore."
And for that, I'm actually
really sorry.
I should have said
that a lot earlier.
I should have been honest.
Well, the yellow jerseys,
the excitement,
the race to the finish,
everything is in place for the
Tour de France, except the big
star.
Both riders and fans
have been looking forward to the
opening of the post-Lance era.
Armstrong was finally gone.
And it looked as though
Jan Ullrich was going to win.
He was in the best condition
he had been in for a decade.
So he had gone to the
Tour of Italy to prepare.
Towards the end of that
Tour of Italy,
there was a huge story
that broke in Spain,
that a doctor by the name of
Eufemiano Fuentes had been
arrested.
It doesn't get any bigger.
After 34 years, I think this
will become the biggest drugs
scandal ever within the sport of
cycling.
Despite proclaiming their
innocence, both Basso and
Ullrich, two of the sport's
superstars, were pulled from the
race after their names appeared
in a 500-page --
That was the last time that
Jan Ullrich was ever seen
at a professional bike race.
He exited stage left
in an Audi driven by his brother
at about 5:00 in the afternoon
the day before the Tour was due
to start.
And most of us
never saw him again.
Others' ambitions may also
now be realized.
Another American, Floyd Landis
on the Phonak team,
may have better fortunes
on the Tour with Armstrong gone
and the front runners
eliminated.
Look at the sweat coursing
down the face of Floyd Landis.
This has been a day
and a half for him.
A man who was dead on
his wheels yesterday
is now just like a superman
of the world of cycling.
Here he comes. Wait for it.
After seven years
of Lance Armstrong.
And they all thought there was
going to be no more Americans
for a while.
They were wrong.
Floyd Landis steps up
to take the Tour de France.
Lance, I'm sure he wasn't
happy that I won the race,
because he had told me directly
to my face in previous years,
that no American was
going to win the Tour de France
while he had the control
of the sport that he had.
I honestly don't remember
much of it.
[ Laughs ]
It's been a long time,
and I spent so much time
trying not to think about it.
I remember it happening
like it was a dream.
The rest of it
went badly after that.
The Tour's winner
Floyd Landis tested positive
for testosterone
following his dramatic victory.
I deserved to win the race.
And that was what
I set out to do --
for me, not for anybody else.
It's unfortunate that
the public has a misconception
of what's going on here.
But that's out of my control.
It's hard lying to people.
I don't like --
I'm not very good at it.
Lance is very, very good at it.
Frankly, he's better at lying
than he is telling the truth.
He's very uncomfortable
being himself.
But I wasn't good at it.
And that's what he was trying to
give me instructions on.
Like, "Hey Floyd, look, you have
to be more assertive with this."
And I just wasn't good at it.
I declare convincingly
and categorically that
my winning the Tour de France
has been exclusively
due to many years of training
and my complete devotion
to cycling.
[ Camera shutters clicking ]
He got torn apart.
He just ultimately was just
ground down.
People I know would be like,
"you know, I heard Floyd's
living in someone's basement,
and he's drunk every day
by lunchtime."
I had hip surgery.
I had my hip replaced I think
two weeks after the Tour.
At that point, they gave me a
bunch of Vicodin and narcotics
and stuff.
So that helped.
I could just drink and check
out.
[ Indistinct conversations ]
I know I shouldn't say that
helped.
I mean, I'm not by no means
promoting the stuff.
But honestly in a twisted way,
it probably kept me alive
because I just could check out.
Hey, everybody.
I know there's been a lot of
reports in the media today about
a possible return to racing.
Just want to let you know that
after long talks with my kids,
the rest of my family,
close group of friends,
I have decided to return
to professional cycling in 2009.
Lance Armstrong
is officially coming back.
Lance Armstrong announced
today he's coming out
of a three-year-long retirement.
I said, "you are f'ing
crazy.
Why would you do that?"
He's like I'm coming back.
I was like, "oh..."
[ Laughs ]
You've got to be kidding me.
Why would you ever jeopardize
that legacy
to maybe win one more?
Like, I think I was looking at
it as like,
"wow, how audacious."
For one moment, I thought,
"man, that is so audacious.
Is it possible I've been wrong,
and he has been clean
the whole time?
Because if he hasn't, this
is ridiculous."
He had gotten away with it up
to that point, you know.
And if he would have just
shut the...up,
it would have been okay.
When I was younger I used
to be like, "oh, like, why would
Michael Jordan try baseball?
You know, why does an old
heavyweight walk into the ring
and then get knocked out when
they already have made
millions?"
And now I sort of realize that
if you spent your whole life
training to be an elite athlete
and you've succeeded,
you don't want to stop
until someone, like, literally
takes it away from you.
Summer of 2008, I was bored.
For whatever reason, I started
working out a lot more.
And I was getting in shape, and
I was like, "oh, this feels
good."
I watched the Tour,
and Carlos Sastre
won the Tour de France.
Carlos Sastre -- I mean, that
was like, "oh, my God.
Carlos Sastre?"
[ Chuckles ]
Me sitting there in 2008
was like, "he is not a worthy
champion of that event.
And so if he can win,
then I can go back and win."
Was the general consensus
that he rode clean?
I don't know.
Once again, he didn't fail a
test.
But I'm very skeptical.
And the main reason
I'm skeptical is "A,"
experience.
"B," he had continued to consult
with Michele Ferrari
during that time.
Yeah, Michele Ferrari
writes great training plans.
But you don't go to him
solely for the training.
Michele Ferrari said to me,
"you cannot cross the line.
They will get you."
Jean-Marie LeBlanc writes
an open letter to me
telling me not to come back.
Jean-Marie LeBlanc
was the most iconic director
of the Tour ever.
You know, he knew how the game
was played.
I was numb reading it.
I remember him sitting there
at this caf? asking me, like,
"What do you think I should do?"
I was trying to explain
to her, who was new to my life,
that this really feels
like a bad idea.
I should have just picked up
the phone and called everybody
and said, "Not doing it.
Not feeling it."
That would have been the smart
thing to do.
I'd have had two days of really
negative press, speculation.
But I would have dodged
everything.
It was exciting
for a little bit.
But it quickly got
kind of weird.
I came back
to Johan Bruyneel's team.
But the team that he was running
at the time was from Kazakhstan,
sponsored by Astana,
the capital.
And so it was this mix
of Kazakhs and Spaniards.
He had Alberto Contador
on the team...
[ Speaking Spanish ]
...who had won the Tour before.
And it was just -- mm.
It was -- I got to training camp
in Spain, and I was like,
"this is...lame."
But Alberto Contador now
is establishing himself as
the leader of the Astana team.
Alberto Contador has decided
he wants to lay down the
foundations of a win number two
of the Tour de France this
afternoon.
Out of the saddle he gets.
Once again, lifts the pace up.
Armstrong is defending here
this afternoon.
He hasn't really lost all that
much.
When you look at the riders
who he is racing...
Contador wins the Tour,
his own teammate.
And rather than celebrating
the fact that, "gee, I came back
after a big break and came
in third in the Tour de France,"
he looks totally...pissed.
Floyd was trying to come back
after his suspension.
He went to Lance and Johan
and said, "hey, can you put me
back on the team?"
I think, you know, he wasn't
even looking for a big salary.
"I just want to race my bike."
They said, "no, we can't.
You know, you're radioactive.
We can't touch you."
End of 2009,
we started this new team.
Even if I want, I can't,
because number one,
there was I think 12 or 14 teams
who had signed a private deal
with the Tour de France.
Of course, Radio Shack
was a new team.
We were not part of that deal.
So we needed an invitation.
Even if we were pro Tour,
we needed an invitation.
So I knew for a fact
if I sign Landis,
we're not getting an invitation
to the Tour.
And I knew it was a time bomb.
But what do you want me to do?
Floyd felt betrayed.
Like, "hey, we all did
the same thing.
I got caught.
You could have gotten caught.
I know your secrets.
You know my secrets.
And, you know, you should be
looking out for me.
And instead, you're turning your
back on me."
Everyone is hopeful,
like Floyd was, that he's going
to come back after two years.
In cycling, they call it
"omert?."
It's like the mafia.
But with the mafia, the mafia,
if you have a problem,
the mafia would tell you
be quiet, don't say anything.
We take care of your family.
You know, all organized,
don't worry.
And you come back when you're
out of prison.
Floyd didn't say a word.
And then after two years,
the system said,
"Look, you're toxic.
We cannot take you."
This is why I disagree
with the omert? word.
The fact is that
in a mafia situation,
where that word comes from,
you have a group of people
who have each others back
if something happens.
This doesn't work that way here.
They stab you in the back.
And so I figured, "look,
I took a bullet for you guys.
I fought. I did what I was
supposed to do."
And then when I go to come back,
they say, "No, you're not
allowed back."
Then you know what?
All bets are off.
The contract is no longer valid.
And that's it.
Floyd called Frankie
because he was fuming mad.
Floyd said, "I'll out that son
of a...
I will not put up with him."
And we thought, "Oh, my gosh.
And maybe he'll do something."
I didn't even proofread it.
I knew if I'd read it, I would
change my mind.
I would just -- like, if I hit
"send," then it's done.
Then I've gone down this path.
And I can't go back.
And how did it feel
once you hit that send button?
For about six hours,
it felt fine.
And then I realized, "Okay,
I've got to deal with this now."
So I sent a few more.
I'm like, "Well, I better write
some really elaborate stories
so that if people read it,
they'll say, 'this guy's either
got a wildly overactive
imagination,
or there's something to it.'"
I didn't have any material
evidence.
We didn't record anything.
We didn't keep anything --
by design, right?
So by design,
there's no way to prove it.
But I figured, look,
if I write enough detail
into these stories,
people will at least say
"well, it's a fascinating story"
and they'll read it,
if nothing else.
[ Indistinct conversations ]
Everybody set?
Yeah.
Give me one word
to sum this all up?
Credibility.
Floyd lost his credibility
a long time ago.
He has nothing.
He's got no proof.
It's his word versus ours.
We like our word.
We like where we stand.
We like our credibility.
It speaks volumes to his mental
state, and the time
of the day they were sent.
I don't need to fill you guys in
on other peoples habits
and lifestyles.
No.
[ Indistinct conversations ]
In his mind, I don't know
that it was entirely true --
partly true.
But in his mind, he took the
fall for the entire generation.
Again, you know, it doesn't
matter what I think or what we
think.
It matters what he thought.
And so he thought that he
took the fall for everyone
that did the same thing.
And he became a complete pariah.
Everybody wanted to treat me
like I was this evil,
cheating liar.
And then I told the truth.
And now, all of a sudden,
"Now he's a rat.
Oh, now he's turning
on his own people."
So it's like there was a
no-win situation.
But I didn't just say,
"This is what Lance did."
I said, "here's what happened
to everybody.
Here's what I did.
Here's what I know about
everything and everybody.
Do whatever you want with it."
And of course, it became about
Lance because everything's
always about Lance.
And that's the way he wanted it.
So that part, he can't pin
that on me.
That's his approach to life.
"It's about me."
They did what they normally do
is they call my lawyer and say,
"Hey, look, you're going to end
up in prison if you keep this
up."
And, so, I sent more e-mails.
I mean, by that time
committed to that path,
that was it.
I was not going to back out.
Okay, we're not filming
on the way back.
Because this no-music...
is lame.
Who has a question for Lance
knowing -- right out of the
gate.
You're ready. Stand up.
Lance...
You're getting up
a little slow there.
Yeah! He's haggard.
I did 10 laps, though.
Okay, good, yeah.
That's amazing.
How long's the track?
We said 250, right?
You did 2 1/2 K.
That's cool.
You rode a mile and a half.
Everyone give it up.
This man rode his bike
a mile and a half today.
This is going to be good.
Thank you.
Yes.
At least one decade.
Okay, so they're very --
there are two very different
people here, between --
if it's Floyd Landis
and Jeff Spencer, because I
still consider my relationship
with Jeff Spencer, who I spent
hours on his table with
every night during the Tour,
to be a special relationship.
So I would need to be
more specific on who.
I mean, I will be specific on
Floyd Landis.
There'll never be a
relationship.
Never.
Most people in this story,
I'm fine to just forgive
and forget and let's move on.
There are a few that
I'm not there yet.
And Floyd's one of them.
I mean, you just can't --
it's not forgivable.
In 2010, you have Floyd Landis
who went public.
And then right
on the heels of that
is the criminal investigation
in the United States.
He was kind of freaking out.
Because stuff was starting
to come out in the papers.
He was getting frustrated
and scared.
And a lot of different things
that I didn't totally understand
were happening.
But I had an idea.
And then when legal stuff
started to heat up,
because we're not married,
there wasn't, like, spousal
privilege either.
So he did explain that to me
at one point.
He was like, " "I don't want you
to feel like you're in the dark.
But there's also certain things,
like, I can't really
talk to you about right now
because you're not protected."
Just everything
just got crazy.
Then everybody's worlds
just got completely nuts.
Lance went on full denial mode.
I went on full no-comment mode.
We thought it was just kind of
like a huge press scandal until
I got a call from Novitzky.
Jeffrey Novitzky, who worked
with the FDA,
was looking into drug use
in professional cycling.
Jeff Novitzky was involved
in the criminal investigation.
He was involved in BALCO, which
was the steroids investigation
of Barry Bonds and baseball.
And he took it upon himself
to be some sort of sheriff, cop
of performance-enhancing
substances around sport
generally.
Federal prosecutors
in a criminal investigation
have the ability to issue
subpoenas to people.
And when those people
get subpoenaed, they can take
the Fifth, which says, "I have
the right not to incriminate
myself.
I'm not going to answer your
questions."
But a federal prosecutor has
the ability to respond to that
by saying, "we'll give you
immunity."
Once you have immunity.
you no longer have the right
to take the Fifth
because nothing you say
can be used against you.
And so you have to answer
their questions.
And if you answer their
questions and you're not being
truthful, you could get
prosecuted for that.
Most of the writers
who testified,
and support staff,
that was the first time
that they had ever told
anyone the truth.
They tried to jog
your memories, so you remember
a lot of this things.
Because a lot of that stuff
at that point had happened --
this was -- I testified in 2010.
So they were talking about
like '95 to 2005.
How awful was that?
Oh, it was terrifying.
Are you kidding me?
I mean, I still had
broken ribs from crashing
out of the Tour de France.
I'm not going to lie,
it was a long eight hours.
The first 15 minutes
were hard.
Then the next 6 hours
and 45 minutes were like,
I don't know, almost like
a religious experience for me.
Like just unloading all this
darkness that had been just --
I kept burying and burying and
burying.
I was always surprised at like
how's this been kept under wraps
for such a long time?
It was too big of a secret for
it not to come out, you know.
But I always thought to myself,
"hopefully it comes out, you
know, 10 years after I'm
retired, and I don't have to
deal with it, you know?"
I'm sure that's what the guys
in the '80s were thinking.
One of the advices of the
counsels were like, "you can't
talk to Lance anymore,"
because Lance was still being
very -- was denying it very
strongly.
For me,
and maybe not obviously,
but it started a long time ago,
started 10 years ago with a lot
of talk and speculation.
Which is, you know,
I think is part and parcel
to being successful
in what is widely viewed as, you
know, maybe a dirty sport.
When you were lying like
that, what was it like looking
at yourself in the mirror?
No problem.
No problem.
Because?
I'm not justifying it
or defending it.
But I'm telling you
it was not a problem.
Because?
Because it was just part of
the -- I was so used to it.
And it was part of the game.
And it was -- it was --
you just kind of become immune
to that.
I mean, it's crazy.
I'm not -- it's crazy
to hear myself say that.
But that's the truth.
When things started closing
in on him, he wanted me
to call John McCain.
Lance asking McCain
to do something, knowing that
he was actually guilty?
Yikes.
I'm so glad I didn't.
If something had gone south and
somehow it besmirched
John McCain's name, I never
would have lived that down.
For a while there,
there was a possibility
that Lance Armstrong was going
to face criminal charges
and could potentially
go to prison.
I figured they were marching
straight towards an indictment.
[ Chuckles ]
I mean, when it lasts that
long.
There is late word tonight
that federal prosecutors
have dropped their
two-year-long investigation
of Lance Armstrong,
ending an effort to determine
whether the seven-time
Tour de France winner
cheated his way to victory
by taking part
in a doping program.
Armstrong repeatedly
has denied the accusations
that have dogged him for years.
Tonight he released a statement
praising the decision.
When we come back...
It was like a "whew,
like, we're in the clear."
I was like, "okay.
I got off.
I'm free."
And even the day they announced
it, you know, just for them,
if they want to bury it
the day before the Super Bowl or
two days before --
or Super Bowl weekend's
the perfect time to do it,
other than Christmas.
Several of his friends
in his circle
were politically connected.
So there's that theory
that it was shut down somehow
from high up
in the Justice Department.
But I have absolutely
no evidence of that.
That evening, USADA
made some statement, you know,
"we're going to continue
to investigate this."
I was like, "oh, right
whatever."
The case gets dropped.
And the guys think
they're in the clear.
But Travis Tygart says, "No,
no, I can pick this up.
And I can bring all the guys in
and ask them to tell me
what they told Jeff Novitzky."
We have to clean out
that system in order
to drain the swamp, so to speak,
and put this sport
on a new pedestal.
I remember a conversation
that I had with George Hincapie.
We were telling George,
"Look, here's our goals.
Here's what we're trying to do.
Sit down with us, be truthful.
And we're going to do everything
we can to both protect you
in the public, as well
as get you the minimum
sanction we possibly can.
And we're pushing for amnesty.
And, George, by the way,
if you're talking to Lance,
this is going to be afforded
to him as well.
We're going to be reaching out
to him to have
the exact same conversation.
We touched base
with Lance's lawyers.
They just had their M.O.
already in place.
And they weren't going
to be part of it.
They were just going to continue
to deny and lie and attack.
Their idea of cooperation
was always based on
not just being truthful
about what you did,
but can you help us nail
somebody else?
I did tell Lance to just come
out and say it.
I mean...this is real now.
It's not just the press.
This is like -- and he was like,
"that's not happening."
I was in Hawaii
doing a half Ironman.
I do the race, fly to France
for Ironman France.
It was going to be
my first Ironman.
I'll never forget this.
I'm sitting in this house
that we are renting.
And Pat McQuaid calls me.
He said, "Jonathan Vaughters
just came up to me
and said, 'Pat,
a little surprise tomorrow.'"
He had been talking to USADA.
He didn't give me much
information.
He just said,
"this is going to be bad."
USADA are on this case,
and they're on very strongly"
or something like that.
"And they're, you know,
this is going to go down."
So, you know, you need to
start thinking about how the UCI
is going to react to this.
And he just --
he just didn't believe me.
I mean, his reaction was,
"wait, you're saying
that a bunch of cyclists
testified that not
only did they know about doping,
that they themselves doped.
And then all of this is coming
out in a couple of months?
He's like, "no way."
He's like, "no way
that people have done that."
McQuaid called me, and then
I'm like, "uh-oh."
I hadn't been
paying attention to this.
But sounds like something's
about to happen.
The next day, "boom."
We turn next to the huge blow
tonight for the man who inspired
millions by beating cancer
and winning the Tour de France
seven times.
The biggest watchdog
organization in sports announced
late today
that they now have cold, hard
proof that Lance Armstrong
was doping to win,
which could cost him all his
medals and his athletic future.
Here's ABC's Neil...
A couple of days after that
then Ironman, the organization,
says "you can't race."
So we just turned around
and flew home.
[ Sighs ]
UCI will ban Lance Armstrong
from cycling.
And UCI will strip him of
his seven Tour de France titles.
Lance Armstrong has no place
in cycling.
After they do all this,
it's within their rights
to issue a report.
And the other lawyers said, "No,
it'll never happen."
That "report"
was the reasoned decision.
And it happened.
And it was this thick.
The anti-doping agency report
is based upon more than
a 1,000 pages of evidence,
including sworn testimony
from US Postal Service riders
who had knowledge of Armstrong's
doping or doping by the team.
?I don't think anybody knew
the breadth of the evidence,
that they would have all these
teammates of his submitting
sworn affidavits
that said this is all true,
this has all happened.
The nail in the coffin is the
testimony from George Hincapie
that Lance Armstrong had doped.
This is his friend
saying it now.
Nike, a long-time
sponsor of Armstrong,
released this statement.
"Lance has stated his innocence
and has been unwavering
on this position.
Nike plans to continue
to support Lance and the
Lance Armstrong Foundation."
Nike was the pillar
that was keeping this
whole fraudulent scheme alive.
What bothers me is when
corporations who have lifted
these athletes onto a pedestal
don't then take responsibility.
Nike, calling the evidence
against Armstrong
"seemingly insurmountable,"
ended it's endorsement
deal with the seven-time
Tour de France champion.
Other sponsors followed suit.
When he knew his world
was going to come crashing down,
he went to Hawaii to hide away.
Just to deal with it
with the family.
And I flew out there to see him
just to make sure he was doing
okay.
And we played golf
every day in the afternoon,
just the two of us.
And crazy enough,
on the 12th hole,
his phone would always ring,
and it would be horrible news.
Nike, Oakley, Giro,
any one of them,
literally phone calls coming in
from Bart and Bill.
"They're gone, they're gone,
they're gone."
All gone in 48 hours.
Like that, gone.
[ Chuckles ]
Yeah.
I wouldn't change a thing.
I work for myself now.
To Lance Armstrong, that
was lost income to him
to this day, which tells me
he hasn't learned these lessons.
He still is somehow justifying
everything that he did,
because he's talking about
that loss of income
as his price that he paid.
If I was a bank robber
and you caught me,
what would you think if I said
to you and said, "Hey, you know,
you cost me $100 million
of income."
There was
a Lance Armstrong building
on the Nike campus.
And it went from the
Lance Armstrong building one day
to literally overnight
boom, done, off.
Lance Armstrong has taken
some major new blows
in the latest fallout from that
doping scandal surrounding
the legendary cyclist.
NBC's Ann Thompson
is here with more on this story.
Ann, good morning.
Good morning, Matt.
You know, it's been a brutal
24 hours for Lance Armstrong.
He's been dropped by his
big-name sponsors --
Nike, Anheuser-Busch,
and Trek Bicycles.
And he's stepped aside
as chairman of Livestrong,
the charity he founded
to promote cancer survivorship.
Our responsibility was to the
foundation, first and foremost.
I mean, we all revered Lance.
But we had to save
the foundation.
And the only way we thought
we could save it
was for Lance to leave.
In very typical Lance fashion
he struck back,
called us all cowards.
It was pretty rough.
The Livestrong situation
angers me.
If it were me, I would have
said, "you're in time-out,
an indefinite time-out.
But you're still the founder,
and we realize that at some
point, that the dust will settle
here.
And not just you,
but we as an organization --
we, you, me, the organization --
can re-emerge."
I worked too hard
to make it great,
and it's just --
it's a bummer.
A lot of people put aside
their lives because it was
an inspiring story.
And then when you discover
that the emperor has no clothes,
and you realize
that you had taken your life
on a completely different track
because you thought
this was a heroic story
with no bad side to it,
I'm sure a lot of people
are disillusioned.
A lot of people are pissed off
that they were lied to.
Do you wish that you would
have cut a deal with Travis,
because he wanted names?
Was it that you wanted
to protect people?
Did you -- Why?
Look, I've already told you
numerous times, and I'm going to
say it again.
I wouldn't change a thing.
So I don't wish I would have
made a deal with Travis Tygart.
Because if you think about it,
there are three potential
outcomes here.
First, is nothing happens.
I never get investigated,
the Feds don't investigate,
USADA doesn't investigate,
and I just keep going
the way I was going.
I don't want that.
Option two is a hybrid of that
and where we sit today,
which is you struck a deal.
Travis gives you six,
whatever the suspension was.
He says nice things about you.
He maybe calls some of your
sponsors and says, "Hey,
please support him.
He's going to support us."
And you kind of get a pass.
Option three is the one I chose,
where it's like "Nope...you.
I'm going to kick your ass.
Bring it on."
And I lose.
Everything.
So I'm going to say it again.
I wouldn't change a thing.
Option one and option two
don't get me
to the place where I am today,
sitting right here.
I needed a...nuclear
meltdown.
And I got it.
Yes or no.
Did you ever take banned
substances to enhance your
cycling performance?
Yes.
Yes or no, was one of those
banned substances EPO?
Yes.
Did you ever blood dope
or use blood transfusions
to enhance
your cycling performance?
Yes.
Lance went to Oprah
by himself.
Didn't even tell our team.
He flew -- he was in Hawaii,
flew over to see her at her
home.
And said, "I'm thinking about
doing this.
I'm going to have to do it."
He called Bill, Bart, and I
after.
We were like, "What?"
I remember he said --
I remember during
the conversation, I was like,
"Is this a done deal, or are
we still talking about this?"
He was like, "Well, she's coming
to town next week."
I'm like, "what, for a meeting?"
"No, for the interview."
I couldn't believe
that he was going to do it.
I couldn't believe that he was
going to do it with Oprah of all
people.
My second reaction was "Wow,
what about all these people
who had clung to the hope
that Lance was right
and everybody else was wrong?
What's that going to be like
for them?"
[ Indistinct conversations ]
I want to love Lance.
I still love him, I guess, at
heart.
But I think it's really shady
that he kept this from us.
We watched him
win seven times.
And we all just stood
in amazement.
And now to find out
that it was based on lies,
you know, it hurts all of us.
I'd like to think that
at some point, you know,
that he would be forgiven.
But the reality is I think
he burned those bridges
a long time ago.
I don't think there's
anything he can do to redeem
himself in the public eye.
When people were saying
things, David Walsh,
Sunday Times,
Emma O'Reilly, Betsy Andreu, you
were suing people,
and you know that they're
telling the truth.
What is that?
It's a...
It's a major flaw.
The day before he taped
with Oprah, he called.
And when he called,
Frankie said, "Come on.
He calls us the day
before he's taping with Oprah.
He's just calling her
because Oprah's going to ask,
'Well, did you apologize
to the Andreus?'"
As if two words
can erase a decade-plus of evil.
Was Betsy telling the truth
about the Indiana Hospital,
overhearing you in 1996?
I'm not going to
take that on.
And I'm laying down on that one.
Was Betsy lying?
Um, I'm just not --
I'm going to put that one down.
If he will not admit
that this seminal incident,
which is germane to his
downfall, happened,
you have to question
everything else that he says.
If it makes everybody happy
that I say it happened,
I'm happy to say it happened.
But I'm also going to be honest
with you and say I don't recall
it happening.
Is it well with the two of
you?
Have you made peace?
Oh.
No.
Okay.
Because...
Because they've been hurt too
badly.
And a 40-minute conversation
isn't enough.
Before Lance was going to
do Oprah, he was flying over to
Maui.
He was like, "I have to sit
the kids down and talk to them."
He had seen his son
having a really difficult time.
And he was devastated by it.
My dad eventually just had
to sit me down and tell me,
"like, that happened.
Like, that's right.
You need to stop sticking up for
me, trying to protect me."
I saw my son defending me
and saying, "that's not true.
What you're saying about my dad
is not true."
You know, he can't...
Yeah.
If it was 2012, I was 12.
Seventh grade, I think.
To receive that news as, like,
a little kid, like, that
really kind of like flipped
my world upside down.
But it was seeing it on "Oprah"
that kind of like really set in.
I don't remember what day it was
but I had school.
And my mom came up to me that
morning.
She's like, "Luke, you know
you don't have to go, right?
Like, it's fine.
You can take a break.
You can take a day off."
I was like, "no, I want to go,"
'cause I didn't want to, like,
show that it was really
affecting me.
Watching my son get out of
the car, put on his backpack,
and walk up to his middle
school, and the crowd of kids
standing on the front lawn,
I looked at that kid and he took
a step out of that car
and a step into real manhood.
It broke my heart into
a thousand pieces.
He'd never said, Dad,
is this true?"
He trusted me.
Mm-hmm.
People ask me a lot, like,
"Why did you do 'Oprah'?"
And the reality is, I knew
that I was going to get sued
six ways to Sunday.
And with that comes depositions,
comes trials, comes sworn
testimony.
So I was going to have to say
those things.
And, so, I just wanted to say
them on my terms.
We have previously had a
deposition where you gave
testimony.
Is that correct?
Yes.
We started off this
deposition by you taking the
oath to tell the truth and the
whole truth.
Do you remember that oath?
I do.
And it's the same oath you
took the last time that I
deposed you.
Correct?
Correct.
But the last time I deposed
you, there is no dispute that
you gave false testimony.
Correct?
Correct.
What assurance do we have
that this time you are going to
tell the truth, when you took
the same oath last time and
lied?
I understand
the significance.
You do recognize that there
is a legal obligation that
you are under to tell the truth
in this proceeding, correct?
Correct.
You do understand
that there can be both civil
and criminal penalties.
Who sued you?
The better question
is who didn't sue me?
It's not a pity party.
Like, no one's sitting there
like, "Oh, poor Lance.
He lost money."
You know, it's the fallout.
It's what happened from, you
know, doing what he did in the
sport.
So if you want to take the good,
you got to take the bad.
And he's the first to admit it.
Like, "Hey, I'm paying the
price, but I put myself here."
For a long time, he was just
angry or he was defensive,
or just pissed, you know, that
the whole thing was happening to
him.
I hated the idea of riding
bikes and...
[ Sighs ]
And the sport of cycling.
And I just hated it.
He kind of ran and hid and
just didn't want to talk to
anybody, didn't want to be
involved.
Funny, he would tell me he
doesn't read anything about
himself, but I'll mention some
obscure thing mentioned on an
obscure message board somewhere,
and he'll know about it.
And that was a fight for him
for a long time just to quit
worrying about the haters.
George gave me a call and
said, "Hey, man.
You know, I don't think Lance is
in a good way.
I know you're going to be in
Aspen."
I was really concerned
about Lance's well-being,
making sure that he was okay,
first and foremost.
Everyone has their timeline
of how they get through this
process, and --
But by the time I went and
and met him for a drink
down at J Bar, he was
obviously way behind me in that
process, because the amount of
venom that was coming out of him
was -- I've never had to leave a
bar and go have a drink
after the bar.
Like, that was that kind of --
that was that kind of
conversation.
The last time I saw him was him
doing the same thing for
Jan Ullrich.
Talk to me about why
you went to Germany to see Jan.
Ugh.
I mean...
it's just a terrible situation.
Jan was in that era, right?
He was in that cesspool
that we were all in.
And he got caught
like we all got caught, right?
And so the reason I went to see
him is I love him.
[ Groans ]
Wow.
[ Sniffles ]
Anyways...
[ Coughs ]
It was not a good trip.
I mean, he was the most
important person in my life.
Nobody scared me.
Nobody motivated me.
These other guys,
whether it's -- you know,
no disrespect to them,
but they didn't get me up early.
He got me up early.
And he just, uh...
He was just a...mess.
When I look at Jan's situation
and I look at my situation,
because they're very similar,
and the timings were similar,
you know, he had all the things
that I had.
He had a wife.
He had children.
He had money.
And that wasn't enough
to keep him together.
And the...sport
did it to him.
And the media let them do it.
The country of Italy
glorifies Ivan Basso,
idolizes, puts him up there,
gives him jobs,
invites him to races.
Puts him on TV.
He's no different
than any of us.
Yet, they disgrace
Marco Pantani.
They destroy him in the press.
They kick him out of the sport,
and he's dead.
He's...dead.
The country of Germany idolizes
Erik Zabel, Rolf Aldag,
gives them jobs, puts them on
TV, invites them to races,
puts them on the podium.
And they disgrace and they
destroy and they...ruin
Jan Ullrich's life.
Why?
The country of America
idolizes, worships,
glorifies George Hincapie.
Invites him to races,
gives him jobs, buys his...
And they disgrace and destroy
me.
That's why I went.
Because that's...
To say that he is the same
as Jan Ullrich or Ivan Basso
or name your other prominent
cyclists from that time,
it's just not true.
None of them had what he had.
The longer I've been inside
of this world,
I don't even know anymore where
the line is between good people
who do bad things and bad people
who do good things.
There is this, like,
Shakespearean quality to the
whole thing.
You just have to, like, enjoy
the infinite complexity
of the characters.
Like, 'cause there are no
obvious bad and good guys.
Lance didn't invent doping.
This is not --
It wasn't his idea.
And he shouldn't be treated any
differently than
Jonathan Vaughters just because
he's a better athlete that
happened to take the same drugs.
I don't understand how one guy
ends up being the Messiah
that's curing doping
and the other guy's somehow
the outcast.
I'm going to be
naturally skeptical
of whatever Lance does or says.
There's pretty good reason
for that.
But by the same token,
I'm not ruling out the fact
that he may have some other role
to play in some positive way.
I don't know.
30 years of knowing a person,
you either love them
or hate them.
I still haven't decided
where I stand after all that.
I really hated him
for a long time.
But I had to let that go
and just move forward.
With regards to how I carried
myself as the leader of a sport,
the leader of a cause,
the leader of all these
communities...
Inexcusable.
Totally inappropriate behavior,
totally took advantage
of my stature.
And for that, I'm deeply sorry.
And I wish I could change that.
I wish I could have been
a better man.
All I can do is say I'm sorry
and move on and hope that others
do, too.
So that means all that gets to
is how do you sleep at night,
right?
Can you live with yourself?
And I can.
---
Do you feel like you want to
be relevant again?
Um...
This is going to sound terrible.
But I am relevant.
I am.
[ Chuckles ] I mean,
it just, it's -- and I get --
look, I know that every headline
starts with the word
"disgraced," or "disgraceful,"
or some version of that word
"disgrace."
Look, the story is so
polarizing, and it's just --
you're never -- it will always
be that way.
And I know that.
And so I don't -- by knowing it,
I don't expect it to change.
I don't want it to change.
I'm not trying to will it
to change.
It's...
It's complicated.
[ Crowd cheering ]
Welcome to the show, Lance.
Thanks a lot.
Congratulations.
The event completed less than a
week ago, right?
On Sunday is the final ride
right back into the heart of
Paris?
Is that what it is?
That's right.
So, what has your life been
like since then?
Just nuts I guess, huh?
Just nuts.
Yeah.
Just basically nuts.
The Tour De France has fallen
on hard times for some reason.
It's gotten a bad reputation
because of drug taking,
enhancement drug, performance
drugs, blood doping, all of that
kind of stuff.
And yet, you come in, a man
literally, clearly at death's
door, and you dominate the
event.
It's just an amazing thing.
And the press over there, those
idiots.
[ Laughter ]
No, but I'm serious.
They wouldn't leave you alone,
would they?
They suggested that, "Well, you
know, maybe there's something
about his disorder that actually
makes him a better bicycler."
Yeah.
Well, that's just crap, isn't
it?
Performance enhancing
chemotherapy.
[ Cheers and applause ]
You and your wife are
expecting a baby?
That's right.
How soon will that happen?
End of October.
End of October, a baby.
You know yet?
A boy or girl, you know?
No, we don't know.
Okay, good for you.
That's a great story, as well.
And here, you know, here in
New York we have the --
1999 surprised everybody.
Nobody -- nobody expected that,
ourselves included.
It just hockey sticked
everything.
Yeah, zero to 60 real fast.
Back here in France, there
are still some who claim that
Lance Armstrong's '99
Tour De France victory was due
in part to the fact that
Jan Ullrich, the '97 champion,
and Marco Pantani the
'98 champion, weren't here last
year.
There were years where we all
knew Lance would be
unchallenged, basically.
And Jan was one of the few
riders in the conversation that
could possibly beat him.
There was always this very
high level of respect between
the two of us.
And he was very different.
I mean, the other guys that were
"rivals," I didn't like them.
And I didn't want to like them.
And it was better for me
not to like them.
I thought. [ Chuckles ]
I see these guys now, they're
like...shaking hands,
being nice to each other.
I'm like, "You wimps.
What are you doing?"
Jesus. Get your hate on, man.
Anyway, so with him, it was just
we were very respectful of each
other.
It was a great contrast.
People even talked about a cold
war, the American against the
East German.
Jan Ullrich's upbringing, one
could say, was fairly similar
to Lance Armstrong's in the
sense that they both came from a
broken home.
Armstrong's father left the
family pretty early.
And Ullrich's did, as well.
He grew up in the former GDR.
East German didn't have anything
to be proud of except for their
sports.
They got selected at the age of
13, according to how they
performed.
People got used to
East German athletes in
particular being these
incredible robotic figures,
that had fallen off a production
line somewhere behind the
Iron Curtain.
He was much more Mediterranean
really.
He was very emotional.
He was someone who struggled
to live the life of a
professional cyclist for 365
days a year.
And it was a shame because his
talent was one of the greatest
talents that professional
cycling had ever seen.
The balance of power was really
established in that first 2000
Tour, and it never really
changed.
And in fact, as time when by,
Armstrong's superiority complex
increased and Ullrich's
inferiority complex developed.
That was really the story
of the rest of his career.
He became a perennial nearly
man, Lance Armstrong's whipping
boy.
Other than that one Tour
in 2003 where he had him by a
minute going into the last time
trial.
And then it rained in Nantes.
And Ullrich crashed.
And as he was going down,
sliding through the roundabout,
I thought, "Okay, that's the
closest anyone's going to come
to Lance.
[ Cheering ]
Lance, as we've mentioned,
you've been on this tour,
coast to coast now.
But one of the big reasons is
you have your book out,
"It's Not About the Bike."
And I went in the book store
last night, and it's, you know,
they'd sold out of the thing.
How does it feel to be a best
selling author?
It's been an amazing
few years.
People like to pick apart the
book.
But the book was...
everything in that book was
true, except for when I say or
address doping, you know, and
take a position against it and
take a position against the
people who are accusing me of
it.
Everything else is true.
I had no idea how
inspirational that book would
become, regardless of any
athletic achievement.
What it meant for so many people
that got sick with cancer, that
read that book, that were
inspired to fight.
As Lance started being more,
you know, getting more famous
and winning more Tours, there
was a lot riding on that.
He's about to become only the
fifth rider in the 98-year
history of the Tour De France
to win this race three
consecutive times.
Because he's an inspiration
to people everywhere, we chose
Tour De France winner
Lance Armstrong as the most
fascinating person.
He's used his fame to spread
his message of hope.
Hey, everybody.
"The obligation of the cure,"
he calls it.
A young athlete gets asked
by Wheaties to be on the box,
I was almost stunned.
I thought that that would never
happen to me.
There was the team that he
was supporting, a sport that he
was building.
Companies that were growing.
And this was like, he had this
on his shoulder.
It is a money machine story.
There is no doubt.
And that's what I always said.
I said, "Hey, it's
Lance Armstrong Incorporated
now.
And then there's Livestrong that
sits over here completely
separate, that is doing what it
can to fight cancer.
It wasn't like all of a
sudden, "Hey, guys, just FYI,
I've been doping."
Like, that's just not going to
happen, right?
I was like, "I can never be
honest about this."
Because all of this momentum
and profitability and goodness
will come crashing down.
2001, we have 9/11.
Lance Armstrong's won three
Tour De Frances.
Goes and wins another one.
All the praise that we put
upon him was all well deserved.
I was never a teammate with
Lance, but my friends were.
And I asked them, how much of
this is mythology, and how much
is it real?
And they would universally say
"No, he's a bad ass."
Oh, and Beloki's gone down.
Armstrong's off the road, as
well.
Armstrong complete control
there.
He's into the field, but what a
great bike rider.
He's gone across.
This is unbelievable.
I've never seen this before.
Armstrong went across the field,
there.
He's back on the road at 4
kilometers to go.
I was in the press room when
that happened, and even
reporters who absolutely could
not stand the man gasped.
Like...[ Gasps ]
Did that just happen?
I've watched that footage a
thousand times.
I still can't believe that he
didn't fall down.
Right here.
Yeah!
It's just amazing to see
somebody who's an athlete of
that caliber, who's been through
what he's been, to come back and
conquer the world of cycling.
[ Applause ]
There was a point in Lance's
life where he could pick the
phone up and call anybody he
wanted.
So there was all this
discussion, right?
Is he going to run for Governor?
Is he going to run for Senator?
He just became, you know,
a global figure.
And for somebody like me, this
was like, you know, the
sculpture of David.
You know, it was sort of
perfectly carved already.
He was a great leader at that
foundation.
You know, he did there what he
did on the bike.
I mean, he was just driven,
passionate, demanded excellence.
You know, was deeply involved.
I think there is this segment
of the population that thinks,
you know, you were doping in
cycling, and you were being
mean to people.
And somebody said, "Dude, you
better start doing something
good," and so then you created
the organization to cover that
up.
[ Camera shutters clicking ]
I never was paid by Livestrong,
and I never was going to be paid
by Livestrong.
Lance was adamant that his
corporate partners support the
organization in a very
significant way.
And he, in several
circumstances, bypassed what
could have been personal income
and said, "No, I want that
directed to the organization."
And Nike was the biggest example
of that.
When Nike came to me with
this idea of making 5 million
yellow wrist bands, selling them
for a dollar a piece, helping us
raise 5 million bucks at
Livestrong...
Um...[ Chuckles ]
I was like, "Wait, what?
That will never work."
[ Cheers and applause ]
Listen up, everybody.
America is wrapping its
wrists in yellow.
The yellow wristbands showed
that people wanted to be a part
of something bigger.
Riders in the Tour wore them.
The Olympics in Athens were a
month later, and Nike gave them
out to all their athletes at the
Olympics.
You had a presidential campaign
later that year where John Kerry
wore it every day.
We sold, you know, 20 million
the first four or five months,
and I think there was over
80 million sold, you know, over
the period of time that we were
selling them.
It was a way for people not only
to relate to, you know, one of
the most tragic diseases that
humanity has seen, but also be
part of the story.
It changed the foundation
forever because it brought
tremendous resources, tremendous
attention, international
attention, and with that, just
unlimited opportunity for new
programing and the ability
to impact more lives.
Before the Lance Armstrong
Foundation, what it was like to
have cancer was totally
different.
It was much more private and
much more isolated.
Lance removed the stigma of
being a young adult with cancer.
It wasn't something to be
ashamed of or embarrassed about.
It almost put you in like the
cool kids club of, "Yeah, I
have cancer, watch out.
I'm tough, I'm a survivor."
Young adults with cancer.
Those issues are totally
different than little kids with
cancer or old people with
cancer.
There wasn't a movement to bring
it all together.
We wanted to fix all that.
How do we make a difference?
How do we demand change?
How do we ask leadership --
I spent probably the better
part of a year going around
to his cancer events, to see for
myself what was going on there.
One of his stops was at a
children's hospital to see young
cancer patients.
And he would not allow me to go
in the rooms with him.
He was like, "No, this is not a
media event.
I'm doing this for these kids."
Alright, if you want to be
totally cynical and tell me that
was for show, but I don't think
so.
I don't think so.
I'm not saying that makes
anything else that he did okay.
But I'm not willing to say that
there was not a sincere molecule
in his body.
I've seen him be the last guy
to see people.
The last guy.
He would come out, and he would
be a...wreck.
A wreck.
Getting cancer is a really...
scary thing.
And, man, when you emerge from
the other end and you're not
dead, it's pretty cool.
And you wanted other people to
realize that you've got hope
in your life.
And frankly, he had the
resources to turn that into
something that benefited a lot
of people.
But if it wasn't a cynical tool
from the start, I think towards
the middle and on, I think it
was.
I mean, we used to refer to it
as "the cancer shield."
It certainly was an influence
in the way people thought about
him and their unwillingness to
believe that it could even be
possible that he was doping.
It is unfair to say that I
used Livestrong as a shield.
That's -- the organization was
too legitimate.
We did too many good things and
too much good work.
Now, I do think, and it's, I'll
admit, I mean, I used cancer
occasionally as a shield, which
is just...stupid.
I came out of a life threatening
disease.
I was on my death bed.
You think I'm going to come back
into a sport and say, "Okay,
okay, Doctor, give me everything
you got, I just want to go
fast."
No way.
A guy who comes back from
arguably, you know, a death
sentence, why would I then enter
into a sport and dope myself up
and risk my life again?
That's crazy.
I would never do that.
That's -- no. No way.
In hindsight, cycling and cancer
should have been kept separate.
Lance's impact on the world
of cancer doesn't excuse the
doping.
Equally as important, doping
doesn't erase his impact on the
world of cancer.
And I feel like everyone wants
to lump them together and throw
them all out because everyone
wants it to be black and white.
But the truth is, it's gray.
I truly believe if you are
diagnosed with cancer in America
today, you're experience is
better than it was pre-Lance
and pre-Livestrong.
Irrefutably better.
I had cancer at 22 and again at
24.
I was a healthy young adult.
I ran a marathon the day before
I was diagnosed.
Cancer treatments like
chemotherapy and radiation can
cause infertility.
Or cancer treatments can be
sterilizing.
But most doctors at the time
weren't forthcoming with that
information.
My own doctor was going through
all the side effects of
chemotherapy and didn't mention
fertility.
In the waiting room was a
magazine with the story about
Lance and Kristen and how they
had just had a bouncing baby boy
because Lance had banked his
sperm and they had done
fertility treatments.
And so here I was a young adult
cancer patient, and I didn't
learn about my fertility risks
from the doctors at the top
cancer centers.
I learned about my fertility
risks from Lance.
[ Baby crying ]
He's such a little talker.
Unbelievable the way he was
conceived.
Give us a jump. Go jump.
To see him now, he's so normal
and perfect.
I still can't figure it out.
It was really sort of a taboo
subject that was kept in the
closet, and Lance was just open
about it.
I think I called Stamford five
or six times, and someone
answered the phone by mistake,
like, after hours, and said,
"Oh, we have a new egg freezing
program for cancer patients.
You would be one of the first,
come in tomorrow."
And two weeks later, my eggs
were frozen and I started
chemotherapy on time.
And today, I have four children.
At Fertile Hope, we started
the first ever financial
assistance program to help
cancer patients pay for
fertility treatments in that
short time frame.
That program still exists today
at Livestrong.
It has helped more than 10,000
patients and saved them more
than $50 million.
And there have been thousands
of babies born because of Lance
and Livestrong's work around
cancer survivorship.
[ Groans ]
Dude.
I'm Luke David Armstrong,
and I'm Lance's son.
I never really bring it up who I
am because I feel like that
would make me come off as
someone that I'm not.
I mean, it is part of who I am,
but at the end of the day, it's
not, like, what describes me.
There's so much more than that.
Would you ever take
performance enhancing drugs?
I mean, me specifically, I've
always felt like grinding for
something, and really, like,
working for a specific goal has
always been so much more worth
it than taking the short cut.
And I also feel that like if I
ever did that and got caught,
for random people, they would be
like, "He's just like his dad."
What's up with your chain out
there?
It rains.
You haven't ridden that bike
in --
Every day I ride it.
Well, the chain's way too
loose.
I know. It's kind of weird.
I have a week left.
I was going to bring it back.
And get it tuned up?
Yeah.
Good idea.
How would you feel if your
son told you that he wanted to
take performance enhancing
drugs?
If we were put in that
position where Luke, who's a
college football player came to
me and said either, "I'd like to
try this, or I am doing this,"
I would say, "That's a bad
idea.
I mean, you're a freshman in
college that's, you know --
it might be a different
conversation if you're in the
NFL.
But at this point in your life
and in your career, not worth
it."
[ Applause ]
Well, thanks, boys.
Hopefully -- I'm not a football
coach so hopefully I can project
enough.
But this idea of work and
process, quite honestly, that
was my favorite part of the
game.
Whether it's diet, sleep,
strength work, tactics, morale.
I mean, all of this minutiae,
the small things, truly, truly
matter.
And so, you know, I'm proud of
all you guys.
I'm obviously proud of number
48.
I think it was important that
I played football because it
wasn't cycling.
So I had my own path to, like,
be myself, to be Luke and not to
be Lance's son.
What do we say?
What do they say here at Rice?
Like, you know, what's the
battle cry?
Rice fight never dies.
Rice fight never dies.
So it's not like "woo woo."
[ Laughter ]
You say "Rice fight," and
they'll respond to you.
Rice fight --
Never dies!
Rice fight --
Never dies!
Man, alright, thanks, boys.
He'll be rocking.
Your mom's coming.
Yeah.
And your grandparents.
And I'm 35 for the scrimmage.
Not 48? Oh.
But that's easy to confuse.
You've worn 48 the whole spring.
I know, I know, I get it.
But he said 48, and I was like,
"Oh, no, I'm 35."
Okay.
Nice meeting you.
Love you.
Good to meet you.
Yeah. 35.
Mm-hmm.
He's out there.
Do you like the snow?
No, I don't love snow.
No, I -- I stop short of hating
snow, but I'm not a big fan.
There was a lot of reasons to
make the move for now.
Quite frankly, you know,
settling the Postal case I think
it was a good thing.
But it still cost $6.5 million.
So, you know, just at this point
in my life, until a few things
significant happen on the
financial side, it was just
easier to sell the home in
Austin, take the proceeds, and
just get that thing out of my
life.
Oh.
Ah!
What is this?!
[ Chuckles ]
Oh, my gosh!
Olivia, do you want to come
with me?
No, I want to go by myself,
I just want to real quick.
Okay. Alright.
You want to race me?
[ Laughter ]
Aaah! I can't steer!
[ Laughs ]
Watch out! Watch out!
Don't crash into me!
[ Screams ]
Hey, could be worse.
I could be Floyd Landis.
What, living in Leadville?
Waking up a piece of...every
day.
Is that what you think?
Yeah. Yeah.
That's what I know.
I don't think it. I know it.
I hope he's changed, and I
hope he's finding some peace.
I don't know why people can't
move on, but here we are.
I grew up in Lancaster County,
Pennsylvania, in the Mennonite
Church.
It had some beliefs that are
unique to their way of life.
I got interested in cycling as a
kid in high school, and my
parents were not particularly
enthusiastic about my obsession
with it.
It took them a while to accept
it.
For me it was a way to go make
sense of the world.
At the time that I got hired by
the Postal Service team, they
had already won the
Tour De France three times with
Armstrong, and so he was about
as big a star as you could be at
that point.
That part made it easier for
Armstrong to control this group
of guys.
He was the boss, and there was
no ambiguity there.
They said that you were the
loud kind of outspoken guy on
the team.
Where does that come from?
Uh...[ Chuckles ]
I don't necessarily like to be
described as loud.
But I guess occasionally I speak
my opinion more than others.
Floyd was a former teammate
of mine, a beloved teammate of
mine.
I loved racing with Floyd.
He's a lot of fun.
Floyd is an interesting
character.
He doesn't play by the rules
that everybody plays by.
He's a free spirit.
And I had my own challenges that
I saw Floyd go through.
I was on a team that went
bankrupt midway through the
year, with Floyd.
And I saw what happened when he
felt cornered and didn't have
options.
I've had to work a little
harder than some people.
I haven't had as many breaks in
this sport.
And it's been 10 years getting
to this team and to the top
level and to be able to race
with Lance in the
Tour De France.
And I've had to fight my way
here so I don't really like to
put up with, you know, petty
little, what do you call them?
Traditions maybe.
[ Chuckles ]
Despite the difficulty of it
and the amount of time and
determination it takes, the
personalities are not
particularly aggressive.
They're often really introverted
people who just like to spend
time riding a bike by themselves
a lot or near other people
without saying anything.
What people see, they see
George Hincapie and think, "Oh,
he's a tough guy."
He's not. He just isn't.
I mean, Lance is.
Lance is a tough, hard...
But the rest of them were not.
And so they'll just take
whatever beatings they get and
smile.
If you were going to be on
Lance's team, you were there to
work for him.
And one by one, those guys
started getting frustrated with
that, wanted the respect,
wanted the higher contracts,
which is just normal.
And one by one, they'd leave.
What do you think?
I helped Lance win his first
three Tours, so I could look
back three years and look ahead
three years and see myself in
the exact same position, doing
the exact same thing.
And I never wanted to look back
at the end of my career and say,
"You know, I wish I had done
that."
You know, a lot of people told
me like, "Hey, you know, you
have the talent to compete in a
race like the Tour."
So I thought I should give it a
shot.
When we were teammates, we were
friends, and then not so
friendly anymore after we parted
ways.
Or I after I left the team.
He wanted to go to another
team and be a team leader and
try to win the Tour, and he's
going to win the Tour.
And you don't want that guy
on your team.
You have a guy on the team that
thinks he can win the Tour?
No!
There's the door.
In 2004, kind of a warm up
race for the Tour De France
called the Dauphin?.
I beat him in this time trial up
Mount Ventoux.
And, you know, I've heard from
sources that he was pissed.
And he called the UCI.
This is what I was told.
And said, "You got to get this
guy."
And sure enough, they called
that night.
So I don't know.
It most likely happened.
If I had to guess one way or the
other, I'd guess yes, that he
had something to do with, you
know, me getting caught.
I think it would be difficult
to overstate the power that
Lance had in the American
cycling industry, in the sport
of cycling for America, and even
globally to everybody involved
in the sport of cycling.
He was unbelievably powerful.
Let's talk about
Lance Armstrong.
What are his greatest strengths
as a rider?
I think Lance is incredibly
determined.
I mean, I think he has a great
tactical sense.
I think he has...
He's got a fire in his belly to
succeed.
I idolized Greg LeMond.
When he won the Tour De France
in 1989 in such dramatic
fashion, I mean, it's the
greatest Tour De France victory
of all time.
And I say that now, and I mean
it.
Greg LeMond is the fastest
man at all the intermediate
checks, over all the 136
cyclists who have gone before
him.
LeMond's time represented an
average speed of 34 miles an
hour.
No Tour De France time trial has
ever been quicker.
Nothing's even close.
I mean, for me, it was super
inspiring to see that, and that
was when I was transitioning
from triathlon to cycling.
So it was perfect time for me.
[ Cheers and applause ]
There was no denying he was a
bad ass bike racer.
I mean, one of the best ever.
He was supportive the first
couple years.
Then the Ferrari relationship
was made public.
Greg LeMond made some comments
that this is either an amazing
story or he's the biggest fraud
in the history of --
You know, pretty harsh things.
I didn't say he's taking
anything.
That's his interpretation of
what I was saying.
I got a phone call from Lance.
He just said, "You know, I
thought we were friends."
I thought we were friends.
And he said, "Well, if you want
to throw stones, I can throw
stones."
The extent of the "bullying"
with Greg, which is all true,
is we were both under this Trek
family, Trek Bikes family.
I was riding Treks.
He had his line at Trek, his own
LeMond line.
And he was becoming more and
more vocal.
LeMond had a bike company
that was part of Trek, which was
Lance's big sponsor.
And Lance used his muscle, his
influence to, in a lot of ways,
ruin LeMond's business.
In how you treated people,
what is the worst thing that you
did?
What is the worst thing?
Everybody in the world needs to
get this question.
What is the worst thing you've
ever done?
Don't deflect.
No, no, no, I'm thinking.
I'm going to answer your
question.
You can think in silence.
Well, cut that out.
You don't need to use that part.
I mean, Jesus, edit.
Probably the way I treated and
spoke about Emma O'Reilly.
That's probably the worst.
I was a soigneur.
Somebody who looks after riders.
I kind of thought if I ever did
want to speak out, it was to do
good.
My whole thing really was about
the UCI.
It's them that are creating this
problem.
It annoyed me that the whole
system was set up not to protect
the riders.
You know, that the riders were
just fodder for other peoples
grand plans.
David Walsh got in touch with
me.
And I thought, you know, he
could make this a helpful,
constructive article about the
problems in cycling.
I was feeling really guilty.
And that's stayed with me for a
long time.
Over being disloyal to my
teammates and to the riders.
Then Pantani died.
Pantani died of an overdose,
but a lot of people say he died
of a broken heart, you know?
Coincidentally dying on
Valentine's Day of all days.
Pantani was an unusual folk
hero.
He used to put on these
incredible shows in the
mountains.
Marco Pantani's moved up to
first.
Pantani's gone over the line in
first place.
Phil, that is unbelievable.
Italy became captivated by
Pantani because to them, he
personified the underdog.
And the Italians always felt
like underdogs.
After 1999, having been
associated with doping, he
almost couldn't face himself,
let alone the world.
The country of Italy
discarded him -- one of their
sporting heroes, who did
everything that everybody else
did.
They discarded.
You grow up being told, you
know, particularly when you're
as a talented athlete like that,
you know, that people are going
to adore you and people are
going to applaud your every
move.
And then you suddenly realize
that your reputation's shot
and you don't have that anymore.
I think that's got to be hard
for anybody.
I think one of the tragedies
of that lost generation of
riders is that the ones who felt
the shame most keenly on their
conscience were maybe the ones
who suffered the most.
And I think that was certainly
the case with Pantani.
Sometimes you've got to stand
up and be counted.
And that's what I said to David.
"Okay, you can use whatever you
want.
I can back up everything I
said."
When David said he couldn't put
in about the UCI and about the
doctors and stuff, I knew I was
in trouble.
I realized it was going to be
more about Lance than cycling.
So now I was left to Lance's
wrath on my own.
We have instigated a lot of
action here.
Every accusation that's come,
every case that's come, we've
sued people, we've opened
ourselves up for investigation,
we've opened ourself up for
inquiries.
And our average, our batting
average in all of them is 1,000.
Do you have any other
evidence to suggest that
Ms. O'Reilly was making up this
in exchange for money other than
the fact that she received some
compensation?
Emma or Steven?
Emma.
Oh, sorry.
Pissed.
Pissed at me, pissed at Johan.
Really pissed at Johan.
Pissed at the team.
Afraid that we were going to out
her as a...
the thing she said, as a...or
whatever, I don't know.
To call a woman a...is just
totally unacceptable.
Um...
That would be...
It's hard to be worse than that.
So why did you do it?
Um...
Well, you know, I had a version
of events in my head that I --
I wasn't trying to say that she
was a...but...
Um...well, why did I do it?
Because I was an idiot and in
full attack mode.
That's why I did it, right?
I would have said anything.
I couldn't be a different person
off the bike.
There was no getting in my way,
and it worked really, really
good for training and racing.
Perfect for that.
It just doesn't work good when
you're dealing with another
human being who's not in the
race.
Paris today opened it's heart
to Texan, Lance Armstrong, who
now is the first cyclist to win
the grueling Tour De France six
times in a row.
[ Cheers and applause ]
It's a great feeling.
Especially nowadays.
Every year, more and more
Americans come here on the
Champs-Elys?es.
And now it's just lined with
Americans, American flags, Texas
flags.
And almost feel like I'm at home
standing up there.
2004 is when the mess
started, where they were
breathing down our throats to
sign a false affidavit
supporting Lance, smearing
David Walsh.
When I refused to do that, it
was just a snowball.
Anybody Lance could talk to, to
smear me, to cast aspersions on
my character, because he wanted
to portray me as some sort of
whacko that you don't want to
believe her.
It was all about protecting the
brand.
Lance Inc.
"Cancer survivor."
If you were not on side with
the secret, Lance would just
cease speaking positively of
you.
Which you say, "Well, that's no
big deal."
But when you're trying to be,
you know, a television announcer
for cycling, like Frankie was,
and the largest star in the
sport is Lance Armstrong and,
you know, the producer of the
show asks him, "Who do you think
would be a good announcer?"
And he says, "Oh, well, you
know, this guy and this guy."
And then, "What about Frankie?"
"Ah, mm."
He's very good at making sure
he's one step removed from true
responsibility of his actions.
You understand that although
we're in the conference room
of your lawyers, you are giving
testimony as if you are in a
court of law.
Do you understand that?
Correct.
The team at the time, managed by
Thom Weisel, didn't have the
money to pay me.
So they insured all of my
bonuses, all of my salary
raises, increases, everything.
They decided, if this guy's
defrauding us and he's cheating
to win these races, they didn't
want to pay the prize money.
And so Lance filed suit against
SCA Promotions, trying to
collect his prize money.
Betsy Andreu went under oath,
Frankie Andreu went under oath.
They said he admitted to doping
in 1996.
Lance denied it.
Tell us what was said during
this conversation in the
Indiana University Hospital
rooms.
Lance was diagnosed with
cancer, so Frankie and I went to
go visit him.
And we were in his hospital
room, but then he was going to
have a consultation with the
doctors, so I said, "I think we
should leave to give you your
privacy."
And Lance said, "That's okay,
you can stay."
The doctor asked him a couple of
questions.
And then came the question,
"Have you ever taken any
performance enhancing drugs?"
And he just nonchalantly rattled
them off.
EPO, testosterone, growth
hormones, steroids, cortisone.
But I just want to make sure.
It's not that you don't remember
whether that the
Indiana Hospital room incident
occurred.
It affirmatively did not take
place?
No, it didn't.
How could it have taken place
when I've never taken
performance enhancing drugs?
How could that have happened?
That was my point.
It's not just simply you don't
recall.
How many times do I have to
say it?
I'm just trying to make sure
your testimony is clear.
Well, if it can be any
clearer, then I've never taken
drugs.
Then incidents like that could
never have happened.
Okay.
How clear is that?
Based on those lies, that
forced the company to settle
with Lance Armstrong and pay him
$7.5 million.
Nobody dopes and is honest.
You're not.
The only way you can dope and be
honest is if nobody ever asks
you, which is not realistic.
The second somebody asks you...
you lie.
Now, might be one lie because
you answer it once.
Or in my case, it might be
10,000 lies because you answer
it 10,000 times.
And then you take it a step
further, and you reinforce it.
And, "Hey...you, don't ever...
ask me that question again."
Right?
And then you go sue somebody,
that's another -- and then it
just -- so that's why it was
100 times worse.
Because we all lied.
The most irrational thing
I've ever seen him do was in
2004 when he decided to chase
down this Italian rider,
Filippo Simeoni.
Simeoni had testified against
Michele Ferrari.
Ferrari was Lance's coach for
all seven of those Tours that he
won.
Lance chased him down,
vindictively sat behind him
mocking him.
When eventually Simeoni
came back to the Peloton,
Lance comes up to the camera
and does...
I mean, you cannot get anymore
fundamentally evil than that.
The God damn thing about it,
though, is it was on
international television.
It was horrible and should have
been embarrassing to
Lance Armstrong.
But he was at a point in his
life where he was getting away
with stuff.
I think Simeoni has done
a tremendous injustice to his
sport and to the people that pay
his bills.
When you're that protected by
the organization that runs
cycling, I mean, you can
actually take out personal
vendettas as well as win at the
same time, and he liked that.
That was his thing.
Filippo Simeoni is right up
there with Emma.
To stoop to that level, that's
not what a champion does.
So I needed to go say sorry
for that.
I went there in 2013, so it had
been nine years.
He said, "For nine years, my
entire life is associated with
you."
This is a guy that was a
multiple time Italian champion
at one stage.
I mean, he'd won some races.
But everybody remembered that
day because I was a...
So it just takes, you know,
those days and hearing those
things to learn and to be like,
"Okay, what you thought was bad
was way worse."
Let's welcome Lance Armstrong
and Johan Bruyneel.
[ Applause ]
I will cut right to the chase
and say that after a lot of
thought, I've decided that the
Tour De France will be my last
race as a professional cyclist.
It will be the last one, win or
lose.
The biggest inspiration in my
life now and the biggest
inspiration in this decision is
my children.
Ultimately athletes have to
retire.
You can't do it forever.
My time has come, and there are
many, many other things that I
need to do in life, so...
Lance Armstrong cruised down
the roads into Paris today to
claim his seventh victory in the
Tour De France.
It was an incredible seven
years for him.
I mean, God, look at today.
Four of his teammates crash
right in front of him, and he
still stays up.
I mean, it's incredible.
The guy -- just he's
unbreakable.
He's untouchable, and he's got
seven wins.
[ Laughs ]
Winning seven
Tour De Frances is not easy.
That's 21 stages times seven.
You need, you know, that's more
than a 100 straight days of not
crashing, getting sick, making a
strategic blunder, making sure
your team around you.
That's extremely difficult to do
that.
That takes a brilliant
competitive mind, a real
powerful leadership.
On the other hand, it's not
clear how well he would have
done if everybody was clean.
Lance Armstrong!
But that's what the world
was, and he succeeded in it.
The cynics and the skeptics,
I'm sorry for you.
I'm sorry you can't dream big.
And I'm sorry you don't believe
in miracles.
But this is one hell of a race.
This is a great sporting event,
and you should stand around and
believe.
You should believe in these
athletes --
When Lance Armstrong left the
Tour De France at the end of
2005, everything seemed to pale
into irrelevance.
He was the film star that
professional cycling had never
had.
He was the most charismatic
rider that professional cycling
had ever seen.
Lance Armstrong's win and
retirement mean many things, but
perhaps none more important than
this -- Americans will never
have to care about cycling
again.
[ Laughter ]
I think he was just enjoying
the retired life at that point.
He and McConaughey were working
out and just enjoying the beach.
McConaughey at that time was as
famous of an actor as you could
possibly get.
You walk into a bar or a
restaurant, and most of the
people there are like, "I want
to meet Matthew McConaughey.
I'm want to have a beer with
him."
Lance Armstrong was like a whole
different level of fame.
There was not a person in that
restaurant that didn't want to
shake his hand, not a bus boy
who wasn't affected by cancer.
Like, every single person wanted
to meet Lance Armstrong that
summer.
[ Cheering ]
Fans have decided the ESPY
goes to...
Lance Armstrong.
[ Cheers and applause ]
He was showing up at parties
that bike racers don't normally
go to.
Thank you, thank you, thank
you very much.
It has been amazing hosting
"Saturday Night Live" this week.
I would say it's been a tiring
week.
He was like the only "A" list
star in American cycling
history.
Did you meet any of your
dad's girlfriends?
Yeah. Sheryl.
She was super sweet.
He dated Tory Burch.
He dated Kate Hudson.
And Anna.
Yeah, he definitely dated
a few people before me.
Um...[ Laughs ]
I've been Lance's partner for
about 10 years now.
And we have two kids.
When Lance and I met, I was
actually living in Vail, working
with a small non profit, working
with young adult cancer
survivors.
So, yeah, something that kind
of drew us together I think was
our work in the cancer world.
[ Water bubbling ]
A little more Parmesan on
there, I think, honey.
Well, you could help out
with that, honey.
I'm going to put a few more
tomatoes on top.
How do you do that?
Have you ever peeled
a potato?
Uh, no.
Never done that.
Sad.
Guys, how did you meet?
[ Chuckles ]
Well...
[ Laughs ]
True story.
It was a snowy night in Denver.
This is not working.
That's the only part that's
true.
No, you did some nice --
you did a nice long crawl right
there.
Oh, look at that one.
And she was kind of coming on
to me at this bar.
And she chased me down the snowy
street.
And I was literally running.
This is not working.
Um...
No, you're doing great.
Okay, let's -- [ Gasps ]
Oh, no! Oh, my God.
[ Laughing ] Oh, my God.
That didn't work very good.
Oh, my God, there's blood all
over the place.
[ Laughs ]
I wonder how deep that is.
You got blood on my cheese.
Call some doctor friend of
ours.
Please, right now!
We have all these friends --
Why is this happening right
now?
No, call some doctor person
friend.
This is an emergency.
I'm actually getting a little
queasy.
I swear to God.
Hey, 911!
What's happening?
911. Doc, 911.
Here it is. Are you ready?
Right on the end.
Just the tip.
You know, I would just wrap
that thing pretty tight.
Just wrap it tight as...
Tight as...There you go.
Okay, alright.
Yeah, this isn't rocket
science, really.
Ugh!
Alright, let's wrap this...
up.
Stop it!
Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry,
sorry.
I think when you're wounded,
you can cuss without --
Max, I'm seriously injured,
bro.
Okay, well, fine.
Can I cuss?
Uh...
No.
Why are you taping it?
Okay, then you can't cuss.
I just wonder who's going to
have the bite of the salad with
my finger tip in it.
Ew, do you think it's in the
salad?
Yes.
[ Gasps ] Oh, my God!
We can't serve that.
That's disgusting.
How annoying is this finger,
Nick?
Should I put it down?
I'll put this hand up.
I need to elevate it.
My parents got divorced when
I was 1 years old, so I was a
little baby.
I never had to, like, deal with
it because I don't even remember
them being together.
Kristin and I divorced
in 2003, which was not pleasant.
The girls were still in diapers.
I will take
all of the responsibility
for saying, "I'm out."
You know, that was
my M.O. at the time, still is a
layer of that to me, where it's
like, "I'm out," you know.
And she didn't say "I'm out."
She wanted to figure it out.
And I just said, "no, I'm out."
Then I have this relationship
with Sheryl
that lasted for years.
Kristin's going,
"Wait a minute.
We just got divorced,
and now I'm reading in every
news outlet in the world
about my ex-husband,
the father of my three kids,
with this rock star."
It couldn't have been easy.
And the irony is
I wasn't that happy.
This is why I so do not miss
living with or loving
or being in a relationship
with anybody else famous, is in
those situations, you just can't
get out.
And then you're afraid.
You're afraid to break the
cycle, and you just stay in.
And I did it.
I did it way too long.
I should have just said, "No,
I can't do this anymore."
And for that, I'm actually
really sorry.
I should have said
that a lot earlier.
I should have been honest.
Well, the yellow jerseys,
the excitement,
the race to the finish,
everything is in place for the
Tour de France, except the big
star.
Both riders and fans
have been looking forward to the
opening of the post-Lance era.
Armstrong was finally gone.
And it looked as though
Jan Ullrich was going to win.
He was in the best condition
he had been in for a decade.
So he had gone to the
Tour of Italy to prepare.
Towards the end of that
Tour of Italy,
there was a huge story
that broke in Spain,
that a doctor by the name of
Eufemiano Fuentes had been
arrested.
It doesn't get any bigger.
After 34 years, I think this
will become the biggest drugs
scandal ever within the sport of
cycling.
Despite proclaiming their
innocence, both Basso and
Ullrich, two of the sport's
superstars, were pulled from the
race after their names appeared
in a 500-page --
That was the last time that
Jan Ullrich was ever seen
at a professional bike race.
He exited stage left
in an Audi driven by his brother
at about 5:00 in the afternoon
the day before the Tour was due
to start.
And most of us
never saw him again.
Others' ambitions may also
now be realized.
Another American, Floyd Landis
on the Phonak team,
may have better fortunes
on the Tour with Armstrong gone
and the front runners
eliminated.
Look at the sweat coursing
down the face of Floyd Landis.
This has been a day
and a half for him.
A man who was dead on
his wheels yesterday
is now just like a superman
of the world of cycling.
Here he comes. Wait for it.
After seven years
of Lance Armstrong.
And they all thought there was
going to be no more Americans
for a while.
They were wrong.
Floyd Landis steps up
to take the Tour de France.
Lance, I'm sure he wasn't
happy that I won the race,
because he had told me directly
to my face in previous years,
that no American was
going to win the Tour de France
while he had the control
of the sport that he had.
I honestly don't remember
much of it.
[ Laughs ]
It's been a long time,
and I spent so much time
trying not to think about it.
I remember it happening
like it was a dream.
The rest of it
went badly after that.
The Tour's winner
Floyd Landis tested positive
for testosterone
following his dramatic victory.
I deserved to win the race.
And that was what
I set out to do --
for me, not for anybody else.
It's unfortunate that
the public has a misconception
of what's going on here.
But that's out of my control.
It's hard lying to people.
I don't like --
I'm not very good at it.
Lance is very, very good at it.
Frankly, he's better at lying
than he is telling the truth.
He's very uncomfortable
being himself.
But I wasn't good at it.
And that's what he was trying to
give me instructions on.
Like, "Hey Floyd, look, you have
to be more assertive with this."
And I just wasn't good at it.
I declare convincingly
and categorically that
my winning the Tour de France
has been exclusively
due to many years of training
and my complete devotion
to cycling.
[ Camera shutters clicking ]
He got torn apart.
He just ultimately was just
ground down.
People I know would be like,
"you know, I heard Floyd's
living in someone's basement,
and he's drunk every day
by lunchtime."
I had hip surgery.
I had my hip replaced I think
two weeks after the Tour.
At that point, they gave me a
bunch of Vicodin and narcotics
and stuff.
So that helped.
I could just drink and check
out.
[ Indistinct conversations ]
I know I shouldn't say that
helped.
I mean, I'm not by no means
promoting the stuff.
But honestly in a twisted way,
it probably kept me alive
because I just could check out.
Hey, everybody.
I know there's been a lot of
reports in the media today about
a possible return to racing.
Just want to let you know that
after long talks with my kids,
the rest of my family,
close group of friends,
I have decided to return
to professional cycling in 2009.
Lance Armstrong
is officially coming back.
Lance Armstrong announced
today he's coming out
of a three-year-long retirement.
I said, "you are f'ing
crazy.
Why would you do that?"
He's like I'm coming back.
I was like, "oh..."
[ Laughs ]
You've got to be kidding me.
Why would you ever jeopardize
that legacy
to maybe win one more?
Like, I think I was looking at
it as like,
"wow, how audacious."
For one moment, I thought,
"man, that is so audacious.
Is it possible I've been wrong,
and he has been clean
the whole time?
Because if he hasn't, this
is ridiculous."
He had gotten away with it up
to that point, you know.
And if he would have just
shut the...up,
it would have been okay.
When I was younger I used
to be like, "oh, like, why would
Michael Jordan try baseball?
You know, why does an old
heavyweight walk into the ring
and then get knocked out when
they already have made
millions?"
And now I sort of realize that
if you spent your whole life
training to be an elite athlete
and you've succeeded,
you don't want to stop
until someone, like, literally
takes it away from you.
Summer of 2008, I was bored.
For whatever reason, I started
working out a lot more.
And I was getting in shape, and
I was like, "oh, this feels
good."
I watched the Tour,
and Carlos Sastre
won the Tour de France.
Carlos Sastre -- I mean, that
was like, "oh, my God.
Carlos Sastre?"
[ Chuckles ]
Me sitting there in 2008
was like, "he is not a worthy
champion of that event.
And so if he can win,
then I can go back and win."
Was the general consensus
that he rode clean?
I don't know.
Once again, he didn't fail a
test.
But I'm very skeptical.
And the main reason
I'm skeptical is "A,"
experience.
"B," he had continued to consult
with Michele Ferrari
during that time.
Yeah, Michele Ferrari
writes great training plans.
But you don't go to him
solely for the training.
Michele Ferrari said to me,
"you cannot cross the line.
They will get you."
Jean-Marie LeBlanc writes
an open letter to me
telling me not to come back.
Jean-Marie LeBlanc
was the most iconic director
of the Tour ever.
You know, he knew how the game
was played.
I was numb reading it.
I remember him sitting there
at this caf? asking me, like,
"What do you think I should do?"
I was trying to explain
to her, who was new to my life,
that this really feels
like a bad idea.
I should have just picked up
the phone and called everybody
and said, "Not doing it.
Not feeling it."
That would have been the smart
thing to do.
I'd have had two days of really
negative press, speculation.
But I would have dodged
everything.
It was exciting
for a little bit.
But it quickly got
kind of weird.
I came back
to Johan Bruyneel's team.
But the team that he was running
at the time was from Kazakhstan,
sponsored by Astana,
the capital.
And so it was this mix
of Kazakhs and Spaniards.
He had Alberto Contador
on the team...
[ Speaking Spanish ]
...who had won the Tour before.
And it was just -- mm.
It was -- I got to training camp
in Spain, and I was like,
"this is...lame."
But Alberto Contador now
is establishing himself as
the leader of the Astana team.
Alberto Contador has decided
he wants to lay down the
foundations of a win number two
of the Tour de France this
afternoon.
Out of the saddle he gets.
Once again, lifts the pace up.
Armstrong is defending here
this afternoon.
He hasn't really lost all that
much.
When you look at the riders
who he is racing...
Contador wins the Tour,
his own teammate.
And rather than celebrating
the fact that, "gee, I came back
after a big break and came
in third in the Tour de France,"
he looks totally...pissed.
Floyd was trying to come back
after his suspension.
He went to Lance and Johan
and said, "hey, can you put me
back on the team?"
I think, you know, he wasn't
even looking for a big salary.
"I just want to race my bike."
They said, "no, we can't.
You know, you're radioactive.
We can't touch you."
End of 2009,
we started this new team.
Even if I want, I can't,
because number one,
there was I think 12 or 14 teams
who had signed a private deal
with the Tour de France.
Of course, Radio Shack
was a new team.
We were not part of that deal.
So we needed an invitation.
Even if we were pro Tour,
we needed an invitation.
So I knew for a fact
if I sign Landis,
we're not getting an invitation
to the Tour.
And I knew it was a time bomb.
But what do you want me to do?
Floyd felt betrayed.
Like, "hey, we all did
the same thing.
I got caught.
You could have gotten caught.
I know your secrets.
You know my secrets.
And, you know, you should be
looking out for me.
And instead, you're turning your
back on me."
Everyone is hopeful,
like Floyd was, that he's going
to come back after two years.
In cycling, they call it
"omert?."
It's like the mafia.
But with the mafia, the mafia,
if you have a problem,
the mafia would tell you
be quiet, don't say anything.
We take care of your family.
You know, all organized,
don't worry.
And you come back when you're
out of prison.
Floyd didn't say a word.
And then after two years,
the system said,
"Look, you're toxic.
We cannot take you."
This is why I disagree
with the omert? word.
The fact is that
in a mafia situation,
where that word comes from,
you have a group of people
who have each others back
if something happens.
This doesn't work that way here.
They stab you in the back.
And so I figured, "look,
I took a bullet for you guys.
I fought. I did what I was
supposed to do."
And then when I go to come back,
they say, "No, you're not
allowed back."
Then you know what?
All bets are off.
The contract is no longer valid.
And that's it.
Floyd called Frankie
because he was fuming mad.
Floyd said, "I'll out that son
of a...
I will not put up with him."
And we thought, "Oh, my gosh.
And maybe he'll do something."
I didn't even proofread it.
I knew if I'd read it, I would
change my mind.
I would just -- like, if I hit
"send," then it's done.
Then I've gone down this path.
And I can't go back.
And how did it feel
once you hit that send button?
For about six hours,
it felt fine.
And then I realized, "Okay,
I've got to deal with this now."
So I sent a few more.
I'm like, "Well, I better write
some really elaborate stories
so that if people read it,
they'll say, 'this guy's either
got a wildly overactive
imagination,
or there's something to it.'"
I didn't have any material
evidence.
We didn't record anything.
We didn't keep anything --
by design, right?
So by design,
there's no way to prove it.
But I figured, look,
if I write enough detail
into these stories,
people will at least say
"well, it's a fascinating story"
and they'll read it,
if nothing else.
[ Indistinct conversations ]
Everybody set?
Yeah.
Give me one word
to sum this all up?
Credibility.
Floyd lost his credibility
a long time ago.
He has nothing.
He's got no proof.
It's his word versus ours.
We like our word.
We like where we stand.
We like our credibility.
It speaks volumes to his mental
state, and the time
of the day they were sent.
I don't need to fill you guys in
on other peoples habits
and lifestyles.
No.
[ Indistinct conversations ]
In his mind, I don't know
that it was entirely true --
partly true.
But in his mind, he took the
fall for the entire generation.
Again, you know, it doesn't
matter what I think or what we
think.
It matters what he thought.
And so he thought that he
took the fall for everyone
that did the same thing.
And he became a complete pariah.
Everybody wanted to treat me
like I was this evil,
cheating liar.
And then I told the truth.
And now, all of a sudden,
"Now he's a rat.
Oh, now he's turning
on his own people."
So it's like there was a
no-win situation.
But I didn't just say,
"This is what Lance did."
I said, "here's what happened
to everybody.
Here's what I did.
Here's what I know about
everything and everybody.
Do whatever you want with it."
And of course, it became about
Lance because everything's
always about Lance.
And that's the way he wanted it.
So that part, he can't pin
that on me.
That's his approach to life.
"It's about me."
They did what they normally do
is they call my lawyer and say,
"Hey, look, you're going to end
up in prison if you keep this
up."
And, so, I sent more e-mails.
I mean, by that time
committed to that path,
that was it.
I was not going to back out.
Okay, we're not filming
on the way back.
Because this no-music...
is lame.
Who has a question for Lance
knowing -- right out of the
gate.
You're ready. Stand up.
Lance...
You're getting up
a little slow there.
Yeah! He's haggard.
I did 10 laps, though.
Okay, good, yeah.
That's amazing.
How long's the track?
We said 250, right?
You did 2 1/2 K.
That's cool.
You rode a mile and a half.
Everyone give it up.
This man rode his bike
a mile and a half today.
This is going to be good.
Thank you.
Yes.
At least one decade.
Okay, so they're very --
there are two very different
people here, between --
if it's Floyd Landis
and Jeff Spencer, because I
still consider my relationship
with Jeff Spencer, who I spent
hours on his table with
every night during the Tour,
to be a special relationship.
So I would need to be
more specific on who.
I mean, I will be specific on
Floyd Landis.
There'll never be a
relationship.
Never.
Most people in this story,
I'm fine to just forgive
and forget and let's move on.
There are a few that
I'm not there yet.
And Floyd's one of them.
I mean, you just can't --
it's not forgivable.
In 2010, you have Floyd Landis
who went public.
And then right
on the heels of that
is the criminal investigation
in the United States.
He was kind of freaking out.
Because stuff was starting
to come out in the papers.
He was getting frustrated
and scared.
And a lot of different things
that I didn't totally understand
were happening.
But I had an idea.
And then when legal stuff
started to heat up,
because we're not married,
there wasn't, like, spousal
privilege either.
So he did explain that to me
at one point.
He was like, " "I don't want you
to feel like you're in the dark.
But there's also certain things,
like, I can't really
talk to you about right now
because you're not protected."
Just everything
just got crazy.
Then everybody's worlds
just got completely nuts.
Lance went on full denial mode.
I went on full no-comment mode.
We thought it was just kind of
like a huge press scandal until
I got a call from Novitzky.
Jeffrey Novitzky, who worked
with the FDA,
was looking into drug use
in professional cycling.
Jeff Novitzky was involved
in the criminal investigation.
He was involved in BALCO, which
was the steroids investigation
of Barry Bonds and baseball.
And he took it upon himself
to be some sort of sheriff, cop
of performance-enhancing
substances around sport
generally.
Federal prosecutors
in a criminal investigation
have the ability to issue
subpoenas to people.
And when those people
get subpoenaed, they can take
the Fifth, which says, "I have
the right not to incriminate
myself.
I'm not going to answer your
questions."
But a federal prosecutor has
the ability to respond to that
by saying, "we'll give you
immunity."
Once you have immunity.
you no longer have the right
to take the Fifth
because nothing you say
can be used against you.
And so you have to answer
their questions.
And if you answer their
questions and you're not being
truthful, you could get
prosecuted for that.
Most of the writers
who testified,
and support staff,
that was the first time
that they had ever told
anyone the truth.
They tried to jog
your memories, so you remember
a lot of this things.
Because a lot of that stuff
at that point had happened --
this was -- I testified in 2010.
So they were talking about
like '95 to 2005.
How awful was that?
Oh, it was terrifying.
Are you kidding me?
I mean, I still had
broken ribs from crashing
out of the Tour de France.
I'm not going to lie,
it was a long eight hours.
The first 15 minutes
were hard.
Then the next 6 hours
and 45 minutes were like,
I don't know, almost like
a religious experience for me.
Like just unloading all this
darkness that had been just --
I kept burying and burying and
burying.
I was always surprised at like
how's this been kept under wraps
for such a long time?
It was too big of a secret for
it not to come out, you know.
But I always thought to myself,
"hopefully it comes out, you
know, 10 years after I'm
retired, and I don't have to
deal with it, you know?"
I'm sure that's what the guys
in the '80s were thinking.
One of the advices of the
counsels were like, "you can't
talk to Lance anymore,"
because Lance was still being
very -- was denying it very
strongly.
For me,
and maybe not obviously,
but it started a long time ago,
started 10 years ago with a lot
of talk and speculation.
Which is, you know,
I think is part and parcel
to being successful
in what is widely viewed as, you
know, maybe a dirty sport.
When you were lying like
that, what was it like looking
at yourself in the mirror?
No problem.
No problem.
Because?
I'm not justifying it
or defending it.
But I'm telling you
it was not a problem.
Because?
Because it was just part of
the -- I was so used to it.
And it was part of the game.
And it was -- it was --
you just kind of become immune
to that.
I mean, it's crazy.
I'm not -- it's crazy
to hear myself say that.
But that's the truth.
When things started closing
in on him, he wanted me
to call John McCain.
Lance asking McCain
to do something, knowing that
he was actually guilty?
Yikes.
I'm so glad I didn't.
If something had gone south and
somehow it besmirched
John McCain's name, I never
would have lived that down.
For a while there,
there was a possibility
that Lance Armstrong was going
to face criminal charges
and could potentially
go to prison.
I figured they were marching
straight towards an indictment.
[ Chuckles ]
I mean, when it lasts that
long.
There is late word tonight
that federal prosecutors
have dropped their
two-year-long investigation
of Lance Armstrong,
ending an effort to determine
whether the seven-time
Tour de France winner
cheated his way to victory
by taking part
in a doping program.
Armstrong repeatedly
has denied the accusations
that have dogged him for years.
Tonight he released a statement
praising the decision.
When we come back...
It was like a "whew,
like, we're in the clear."
I was like, "okay.
I got off.
I'm free."
And even the day they announced
it, you know, just for them,
if they want to bury it
the day before the Super Bowl or
two days before --
or Super Bowl weekend's
the perfect time to do it,
other than Christmas.
Several of his friends
in his circle
were politically connected.
So there's that theory
that it was shut down somehow
from high up
in the Justice Department.
But I have absolutely
no evidence of that.
That evening, USADA
made some statement, you know,
"we're going to continue
to investigate this."
I was like, "oh, right
whatever."
The case gets dropped.
And the guys think
they're in the clear.
But Travis Tygart says, "No,
no, I can pick this up.
And I can bring all the guys in
and ask them to tell me
what they told Jeff Novitzky."
We have to clean out
that system in order
to drain the swamp, so to speak,
and put this sport
on a new pedestal.
I remember a conversation
that I had with George Hincapie.
We were telling George,
"Look, here's our goals.
Here's what we're trying to do.
Sit down with us, be truthful.
And we're going to do everything
we can to both protect you
in the public, as well
as get you the minimum
sanction we possibly can.
And we're pushing for amnesty.
And, George, by the way,
if you're talking to Lance,
this is going to be afforded
to him as well.
We're going to be reaching out
to him to have
the exact same conversation.
We touched base
with Lance's lawyers.
They just had their M.O.
already in place.
And they weren't going
to be part of it.
They were just going to continue
to deny and lie and attack.
Their idea of cooperation
was always based on
not just being truthful
about what you did,
but can you help us nail
somebody else?
I did tell Lance to just come
out and say it.
I mean...this is real now.
It's not just the press.
This is like -- and he was like,
"that's not happening."
I was in Hawaii
doing a half Ironman.
I do the race, fly to France
for Ironman France.
It was going to be
my first Ironman.
I'll never forget this.
I'm sitting in this house
that we are renting.
And Pat McQuaid calls me.
He said, "Jonathan Vaughters
just came up to me
and said, 'Pat,
a little surprise tomorrow.'"
He had been talking to USADA.
He didn't give me much
information.
He just said,
"this is going to be bad."
USADA are on this case,
and they're on very strongly"
or something like that.
"And they're, you know,
this is going to go down."
So, you know, you need to
start thinking about how the UCI
is going to react to this.
And he just --
he just didn't believe me.
I mean, his reaction was,
"wait, you're saying
that a bunch of cyclists
testified that not
only did they know about doping,
that they themselves doped.
And then all of this is coming
out in a couple of months?
He's like, "no way."
He's like, "no way
that people have done that."
McQuaid called me, and then
I'm like, "uh-oh."
I hadn't been
paying attention to this.
But sounds like something's
about to happen.
The next day, "boom."
We turn next to the huge blow
tonight for the man who inspired
millions by beating cancer
and winning the Tour de France
seven times.
The biggest watchdog
organization in sports announced
late today
that they now have cold, hard
proof that Lance Armstrong
was doping to win,
which could cost him all his
medals and his athletic future.
Here's ABC's Neil...
A couple of days after that
then Ironman, the organization,
says "you can't race."
So we just turned around
and flew home.
[ Sighs ]
UCI will ban Lance Armstrong
from cycling.
And UCI will strip him of
his seven Tour de France titles.
Lance Armstrong has no place
in cycling.
After they do all this,
it's within their rights
to issue a report.
And the other lawyers said, "No,
it'll never happen."
That "report"
was the reasoned decision.
And it happened.
And it was this thick.
The anti-doping agency report
is based upon more than
a 1,000 pages of evidence,
including sworn testimony
from US Postal Service riders
who had knowledge of Armstrong's
doping or doping by the team.
?I don't think anybody knew
the breadth of the evidence,
that they would have all these
teammates of his submitting
sworn affidavits
that said this is all true,
this has all happened.
The nail in the coffin is the
testimony from George Hincapie
that Lance Armstrong had doped.
This is his friend
saying it now.
Nike, a long-time
sponsor of Armstrong,
released this statement.
"Lance has stated his innocence
and has been unwavering
on this position.
Nike plans to continue
to support Lance and the
Lance Armstrong Foundation."
Nike was the pillar
that was keeping this
whole fraudulent scheme alive.
What bothers me is when
corporations who have lifted
these athletes onto a pedestal
don't then take responsibility.
Nike, calling the evidence
against Armstrong
"seemingly insurmountable,"
ended it's endorsement
deal with the seven-time
Tour de France champion.
Other sponsors followed suit.
When he knew his world
was going to come crashing down,
he went to Hawaii to hide away.
Just to deal with it
with the family.
And I flew out there to see him
just to make sure he was doing
okay.
And we played golf
every day in the afternoon,
just the two of us.
And crazy enough,
on the 12th hole,
his phone would always ring,
and it would be horrible news.
Nike, Oakley, Giro,
any one of them,
literally phone calls coming in
from Bart and Bill.
"They're gone, they're gone,
they're gone."
All gone in 48 hours.
Like that, gone.
[ Chuckles ]
Yeah.
I wouldn't change a thing.
I work for myself now.
To Lance Armstrong, that
was lost income to him
to this day, which tells me
he hasn't learned these lessons.
He still is somehow justifying
everything that he did,
because he's talking about
that loss of income
as his price that he paid.
If I was a bank robber
and you caught me,
what would you think if I said
to you and said, "Hey, you know,
you cost me $100 million
of income."
There was
a Lance Armstrong building
on the Nike campus.
And it went from the
Lance Armstrong building one day
to literally overnight
boom, done, off.
Lance Armstrong has taken
some major new blows
in the latest fallout from that
doping scandal surrounding
the legendary cyclist.
NBC's Ann Thompson
is here with more on this story.
Ann, good morning.
Good morning, Matt.
You know, it's been a brutal
24 hours for Lance Armstrong.
He's been dropped by his
big-name sponsors --
Nike, Anheuser-Busch,
and Trek Bicycles.
And he's stepped aside
as chairman of Livestrong,
the charity he founded
to promote cancer survivorship.
Our responsibility was to the
foundation, first and foremost.
I mean, we all revered Lance.
But we had to save
the foundation.
And the only way we thought
we could save it
was for Lance to leave.
In very typical Lance fashion
he struck back,
called us all cowards.
It was pretty rough.
The Livestrong situation
angers me.
If it were me, I would have
said, "you're in time-out,
an indefinite time-out.
But you're still the founder,
and we realize that at some
point, that the dust will settle
here.
And not just you,
but we as an organization --
we, you, me, the organization --
can re-emerge."
I worked too hard
to make it great,
and it's just --
it's a bummer.
A lot of people put aside
their lives because it was
an inspiring story.
And then when you discover
that the emperor has no clothes,
and you realize
that you had taken your life
on a completely different track
because you thought
this was a heroic story
with no bad side to it,
I'm sure a lot of people
are disillusioned.
A lot of people are pissed off
that they were lied to.
Do you wish that you would
have cut a deal with Travis,
because he wanted names?
Was it that you wanted
to protect people?
Did you -- Why?
Look, I've already told you
numerous times, and I'm going to
say it again.
I wouldn't change a thing.
So I don't wish I would have
made a deal with Travis Tygart.
Because if you think about it,
there are three potential
outcomes here.
First, is nothing happens.
I never get investigated,
the Feds don't investigate,
USADA doesn't investigate,
and I just keep going
the way I was going.
I don't want that.
Option two is a hybrid of that
and where we sit today,
which is you struck a deal.
Travis gives you six,
whatever the suspension was.
He says nice things about you.
He maybe calls some of your
sponsors and says, "Hey,
please support him.
He's going to support us."
And you kind of get a pass.
Option three is the one I chose,
where it's like "Nope...you.
I'm going to kick your ass.
Bring it on."
And I lose.
Everything.
So I'm going to say it again.
I wouldn't change a thing.
Option one and option two
don't get me
to the place where I am today,
sitting right here.
I needed a...nuclear
meltdown.
And I got it.
Yes or no.
Did you ever take banned
substances to enhance your
cycling performance?
Yes.
Yes or no, was one of those
banned substances EPO?
Yes.
Did you ever blood dope
or use blood transfusions
to enhance
your cycling performance?
Yes.
Lance went to Oprah
by himself.
Didn't even tell our team.
He flew -- he was in Hawaii,
flew over to see her at her
home.
And said, "I'm thinking about
doing this.
I'm going to have to do it."
He called Bill, Bart, and I
after.
We were like, "What?"
I remember he said --
I remember during
the conversation, I was like,
"Is this a done deal, or are
we still talking about this?"
He was like, "Well, she's coming
to town next week."
I'm like, "what, for a meeting?"
"No, for the interview."
I couldn't believe
that he was going to do it.
I couldn't believe that he was
going to do it with Oprah of all
people.
My second reaction was "Wow,
what about all these people
who had clung to the hope
that Lance was right
and everybody else was wrong?
What's that going to be like
for them?"
[ Indistinct conversations ]
I want to love Lance.
I still love him, I guess, at
heart.
But I think it's really shady
that he kept this from us.
We watched him
win seven times.
And we all just stood
in amazement.
And now to find out
that it was based on lies,
you know, it hurts all of us.
I'd like to think that
at some point, you know,
that he would be forgiven.
But the reality is I think
he burned those bridges
a long time ago.
I don't think there's
anything he can do to redeem
himself in the public eye.
When people were saying
things, David Walsh,
Sunday Times,
Emma O'Reilly, Betsy Andreu, you
were suing people,
and you know that they're
telling the truth.
What is that?
It's a...
It's a major flaw.
The day before he taped
with Oprah, he called.
And when he called,
Frankie said, "Come on.
He calls us the day
before he's taping with Oprah.
He's just calling her
because Oprah's going to ask,
'Well, did you apologize
to the Andreus?'"
As if two words
can erase a decade-plus of evil.
Was Betsy telling the truth
about the Indiana Hospital,
overhearing you in 1996?
I'm not going to
take that on.
And I'm laying down on that one.
Was Betsy lying?
Um, I'm just not --
I'm going to put that one down.
If he will not admit
that this seminal incident,
which is germane to his
downfall, happened,
you have to question
everything else that he says.
If it makes everybody happy
that I say it happened,
I'm happy to say it happened.
But I'm also going to be honest
with you and say I don't recall
it happening.
Is it well with the two of
you?
Have you made peace?
Oh.
No.
Okay.
Because...
Because they've been hurt too
badly.
And a 40-minute conversation
isn't enough.
Before Lance was going to
do Oprah, he was flying over to
Maui.
He was like, "I have to sit
the kids down and talk to them."
He had seen his son
having a really difficult time.
And he was devastated by it.
My dad eventually just had
to sit me down and tell me,
"like, that happened.
Like, that's right.
You need to stop sticking up for
me, trying to protect me."
I saw my son defending me
and saying, "that's not true.
What you're saying about my dad
is not true."
You know, he can't...
Yeah.
If it was 2012, I was 12.
Seventh grade, I think.
To receive that news as, like,
a little kid, like, that
really kind of like flipped
my world upside down.
But it was seeing it on "Oprah"
that kind of like really set in.
I don't remember what day it was
but I had school.
And my mom came up to me that
morning.
She's like, "Luke, you know
you don't have to go, right?
Like, it's fine.
You can take a break.
You can take a day off."
I was like, "no, I want to go,"
'cause I didn't want to, like,
show that it was really
affecting me.
Watching my son get out of
the car, put on his backpack,
and walk up to his middle
school, and the crowd of kids
standing on the front lawn,
I looked at that kid and he took
a step out of that car
and a step into real manhood.
It broke my heart into
a thousand pieces.
He'd never said, Dad,
is this true?"
He trusted me.
Mm-hmm.
People ask me a lot, like,
"Why did you do 'Oprah'?"
And the reality is, I knew
that I was going to get sued
six ways to Sunday.
And with that comes depositions,
comes trials, comes sworn
testimony.
So I was going to have to say
those things.
And, so, I just wanted to say
them on my terms.
We have previously had a
deposition where you gave
testimony.
Is that correct?
Yes.
We started off this
deposition by you taking the
oath to tell the truth and the
whole truth.
Do you remember that oath?
I do.
And it's the same oath you
took the last time that I
deposed you.
Correct?
Correct.
But the last time I deposed
you, there is no dispute that
you gave false testimony.
Correct?
Correct.
What assurance do we have
that this time you are going to
tell the truth, when you took
the same oath last time and
lied?
I understand
the significance.
You do recognize that there
is a legal obligation that
you are under to tell the truth
in this proceeding, correct?
Correct.
You do understand
that there can be both civil
and criminal penalties.
Who sued you?
The better question
is who didn't sue me?
It's not a pity party.
Like, no one's sitting there
like, "Oh, poor Lance.
He lost money."
You know, it's the fallout.
It's what happened from, you
know, doing what he did in the
sport.
So if you want to take the good,
you got to take the bad.
And he's the first to admit it.
Like, "Hey, I'm paying the
price, but I put myself here."
For a long time, he was just
angry or he was defensive,
or just pissed, you know, that
the whole thing was happening to
him.
I hated the idea of riding
bikes and...
[ Sighs ]
And the sport of cycling.
And I just hated it.
He kind of ran and hid and
just didn't want to talk to
anybody, didn't want to be
involved.
Funny, he would tell me he
doesn't read anything about
himself, but I'll mention some
obscure thing mentioned on an
obscure message board somewhere,
and he'll know about it.
And that was a fight for him
for a long time just to quit
worrying about the haters.
George gave me a call and
said, "Hey, man.
You know, I don't think Lance is
in a good way.
I know you're going to be in
Aspen."
I was really concerned
about Lance's well-being,
making sure that he was okay,
first and foremost.
Everyone has their timeline
of how they get through this
process, and --
But by the time I went and
and met him for a drink
down at J Bar, he was
obviously way behind me in that
process, because the amount of
venom that was coming out of him
was -- I've never had to leave a
bar and go have a drink
after the bar.
Like, that was that kind of --
that was that kind of
conversation.
The last time I saw him was him
doing the same thing for
Jan Ullrich.
Talk to me about why
you went to Germany to see Jan.
Ugh.
I mean...
it's just a terrible situation.
Jan was in that era, right?
He was in that cesspool
that we were all in.
And he got caught
like we all got caught, right?
And so the reason I went to see
him is I love him.
[ Groans ]
Wow.
[ Sniffles ]
Anyways...
[ Coughs ]
It was not a good trip.
I mean, he was the most
important person in my life.
Nobody scared me.
Nobody motivated me.
These other guys,
whether it's -- you know,
no disrespect to them,
but they didn't get me up early.
He got me up early.
And he just, uh...
He was just a...mess.
When I look at Jan's situation
and I look at my situation,
because they're very similar,
and the timings were similar,
you know, he had all the things
that I had.
He had a wife.
He had children.
He had money.
And that wasn't enough
to keep him together.
And the...sport
did it to him.
And the media let them do it.
The country of Italy
glorifies Ivan Basso,
idolizes, puts him up there,
gives him jobs,
invites him to races.
Puts him on TV.
He's no different
than any of us.
Yet, they disgrace
Marco Pantani.
They destroy him in the press.
They kick him out of the sport,
and he's dead.
He's...dead.
The country of Germany idolizes
Erik Zabel, Rolf Aldag,
gives them jobs, puts them on
TV, invites them to races,
puts them on the podium.
And they disgrace and they
destroy and they...ruin
Jan Ullrich's life.
Why?
The country of America
idolizes, worships,
glorifies George Hincapie.
Invites him to races,
gives him jobs, buys his...
And they disgrace and destroy
me.
That's why I went.
Because that's...
To say that he is the same
as Jan Ullrich or Ivan Basso
or name your other prominent
cyclists from that time,
it's just not true.
None of them had what he had.
The longer I've been inside
of this world,
I don't even know anymore where
the line is between good people
who do bad things and bad people
who do good things.
There is this, like,
Shakespearean quality to the
whole thing.
You just have to, like, enjoy
the infinite complexity
of the characters.
Like, 'cause there are no
obvious bad and good guys.
Lance didn't invent doping.
This is not --
It wasn't his idea.
And he shouldn't be treated any
differently than
Jonathan Vaughters just because
he's a better athlete that
happened to take the same drugs.
I don't understand how one guy
ends up being the Messiah
that's curing doping
and the other guy's somehow
the outcast.
I'm going to be
naturally skeptical
of whatever Lance does or says.
There's pretty good reason
for that.
But by the same token,
I'm not ruling out the fact
that he may have some other role
to play in some positive way.
I don't know.
30 years of knowing a person,
you either love them
or hate them.
I still haven't decided
where I stand after all that.
I really hated him
for a long time.
But I had to let that go
and just move forward.
With regards to how I carried
myself as the leader of a sport,
the leader of a cause,
the leader of all these
communities...
Inexcusable.
Totally inappropriate behavior,
totally took advantage
of my stature.
And for that, I'm deeply sorry.
And I wish I could change that.
I wish I could have been
a better man.
All I can do is say I'm sorry
and move on and hope that others
do, too.
So that means all that gets to
is how do you sleep at night,
right?
Can you live with yourself?
And I can.