D'amore si vive (1984) - full transcript

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For an independent author's cinema

THE MARCH 11
CINEMATOGRAPHY

PRESENTS

OF LOVE YOU LIVE

A RESEARCH BY
SILVANO AGOSTI

THIS RESEARCH IS A FIRST STEP
TOWARDS A WIDER DISCUSSION ABOUT

TENDERNESS, SEXUALITY, LOVE

I was patient and...

I helped him out.

I did it with all my strength,

and in fact, he was born
after five or six shoves.



I pushed from head to toe
and he came out,

and it was not painful.

It was...

almost like drinking a glass of water.

From that moment,
the delivery ended,

which went, anyway, very well,

almost easy.

Bumblebees bring good luck!

And then they put it on my
chest, here, to the heart,

and stayed there for ten minutes,
and looked us in the eye,

and I felt... light as air,

and tried to decipher
what I felt towards him,

and there was no feeling.

I was empty of all emotion.



It was all like air, period.

Empty, completely empty.

I need declarations of love.
Do you understand?

A mother, or a friend, or
a husband, or a lover

can't hold on to someone,

because what he said one time,
he shouldn't stop saying it.

And above all...

he should say it always...

You should make him understand,
one way or another,

that it can't be said
once and for all and then no more

Try to tell me...
If you can tell me...

your first wedding night.

The what?!

The first wedding night?

My God... that's long ago!

But tell me.

I felt terrified.

Tell it!

Okay... I tell it, I tell it...

What I remember?

The first thing
that I remember is that...

I was, or we were...

in a hostel not far from here,

in midsummer,
and it was tremendously hot.

The mosquitoes
didn't stop bothering me,

I was bothered
by the street noise, by the heat.

And on top of that
the shower didn't work,

and I went to bed
with the pleasant feeling...

of this stuck shower,
of all this stagnant water.

It was full of water

That is what I remember most.

- And you were a virgin?
- Yes.

Tell me, you got into bed.
And then?

We went to bed and I was wearing
a white shirt, very pretty,

that he had bought me

for the occasion.

And that's how we had...

so we did...

We tried to make love,

but we didn't do it.

Because I went crazy with pain,
I felt bad.

I lived it that way,
a bit as a thing...

difficult, this act of love.

Something complicated.

I felt really tormented,
also because...

the whole load was placed on me...

of an education, I was very
scared of the sexual act.

How's that, you didn't make love?
How long did that last?

For quite some time,
because I always felt this...

this feeling of physical pain,

which was obviously not just
physical pain, it was...

it was a resistance,

psychological, mental, in myself.

How many years did you remain
a virgin, once married?

Well, I remained a virgin for...

one year.

And then, what happened
after that year?

I made a...

I am...

I made a, I went...

In fact, I don't really want to...

I went to a...

I went to see a doctor...

And what did he do to you?

Well, the doctor...

He told me that my resistance
was purely psychological.

But he thought that perhaps...

He, in good faith, wanted to help me.

He thought that taking off my
hymen through a surgical act

would contribute
to the resolution of my problems.

And this is what he did.

And what did he do?

He did that operation to me.

And then?

And then it was like before.

How long did you remain a virgin
after the operation?

I don't know...
but at some point I got pregnant.

But how?

But how... but how...

- Without making love?
- Yes, yes, while making love.

But how?

Hey... while making love.

all things considering,
in a fairly complete way.

Tell me something about this way
of making love with your husband.

I experienced exactly the same pains,

the same resistances,
the same difficulties.

Even after...

they took it away,

this piece of skin.

I suffered exactly the same.

It seemed an impossible thing to me.

It seemed impossible to me.

That such a thing...

could enter in a hole
that didn't exist for me.

I didn't feel it.

What's that, "this kind of thing"?

The penis.

And why didn't your vagina
exist for you?

Because I didn't feel it,
I wasn't aware of it.

I kept on asking my gynaecologist
if I had this hole or not.

I kept asking him questions,
and he was losing patience,

to tell you the truth,
he took me a bit, for a...

not that he told me I was crazy, but...

He kept on telling me to go
to a psychologist, a psychoanalyst,

because I kept questioning him
about the existence or non-existence

of an opening in me.

Because I didn't feel it,
I had no awareness of it.

I didn't know if I had one or not.

I didn't manage
to understand the mystery...

of my periods,
I didn't know where they came from.

They came from somewhere...

But you never explored yourself?

No, no, no, please!

Why?

Because... I always had...

for a long time...

this bad relationship
with my body and this...

this tremendous fear of sex and...

this terror of impurity
that stayed with me.

That had been instilled in
me since I was very little,

that has always accompanied me.

I don't know with what motive.
Yes, now I can understand.

Thinking about it,
I always had close to me...

in a protective way...

and trouble at the same time...

figures...

in short, religious figures
who have always instilled me...

this idea of chastity.

Chastity, impurity, impurity
and chastity, continually

they haunted me,
these religious figures,

and they were often at home,
they were friends of my parents,

they cared a lot about
my spiritual life and so,

it seemed to me,

that they would like
to cultivate in me a creature...

elect,

particular,

they wanted to heal my soul.

But while taking care of my soul,

they have

made my body live in a
schizophrenic way, as if

it was a despicable wrapper,
which must be ignored.

And that, maybe...

let's say...

that this...

taboo...

of body and sexy, even though
in part I have overcome it,

it stayed with me in
the relationship that I have with water,

the continuing need to...

stay in water, to wash myself,

to feel the water running
over me, to remain close to...

rivers, lakes, especially rivers.

This need, also, to feel the water,

to feel that it washes,
that it runs, that it is clean.

You teach, right?

Yes.

How many years have you been teaching?

Well... since I graduated

that is to say...

since...

for quite some time.

Since... 16 years

I did not want this child.

I punished my body, tightened my belt.

I had reached the seventh month

of tightening belts
with all my strength,

to deny this belly,
to deny this pregnancy,

and I wanted that my life...

would have a normal dimension
and I tightened the belt a lot,

as if I were not pregnant.

I did not want this child.

And why didn't you abort?

Because I thought about it,
and thought about it...

and time had passed.

Do you know, that I am
the daughter of a priest?

A priest... a real priest?

I never really had
a sexual relationship.

So what did you do?

Touch and kiss.

And how did it happen?

Okay...

This friend of mine...

came here to my house,

while we were playing.

I explained to her
what is a sexual relationship.

Do you get it?

And what did you explain?

I told her...
that you feel pleasure,

that you feel good,
that you feel love...

You feel everything.

You think about unusual things
when you make love, don't you?

True?

So...

She told me: "What if we tried it?"

Hmm, right?

and I accepted.

so we went behind the hill.

After recording
I'll show you the site.

Do you want to see it?

So...

We started kissing

to kiss one another...

and we started touching,

and we felt good.

And then... we were done.

And I asked her
if she had liked it,

and she told me...

that she had never felt
such a thing.

No? Right?

Okay...

and I said...

that I was very happy.

And she told me that too.

Then we came back here,

and we played all the time.

But... we were happier, more content,

better, to sum it up.

And then one time,

once,

I wanked off and something came out.

Like whipped cream,
no, just kidding.

Something... a bit sticky.

It was white, well,
rather greyish,

whiter than grey, I mean.

It was soft.

Well it was...

solid, a bit solid.

Like lava, you know?

Well, like lava but white.

And then,

when this thing came out,

I felt pleasure,
so I consulted a book.

It explained
that it was a man's semen.

That with sperm you can
fertilize a woman, etc.

and then... I...

I was proud, right?

Because there aren't
many 9 year olds

who have sperm so soon.

Who's that? So...

I was very proud

Why can't children
kiss and touch when they want?

I don't know, it may be because...

because they are afraid,
or because...

parents do not want it.

And why would that be?

Well, because, maybe,
parents cannot understand

the pleasure of a child with a child.

Are you trying to say that children
have needs, such as feeling pleasure?

Yes.

Can you explain these needs?

Well, I explain it
in my own words.

Children need pleasure,
just like adults, right?

Because children are human beings,
like all of us, right?

They are human beings, but small,

if you look at it, a child's memory
could be like the older one's.

Explain yourself better, what
you are saying is something important.

How so, I'd have
to explain myself better?

What would you like the elders
to tell the children?

To the kids?

That we are like them.

What do you mean?

What do I mean?

An adult has a car,

has love,

has a girlfriend,

everything... that is...

he has weapons.

and we have to have those,
just like them!

- To have everything?
- Yes!

Because to children,
if you explain things to them,

it's that...

because you see, men
boom boom boom...

they shoot like mad with pistols.

Now, if you make children understand

they can collect real weapons,

and shoot...

they might just shoot one shot
on new year's eve and that's it.

While men kill themselves with them.

Yes, like in that war.

What war?

Between...

England

and... Argentina.

A war.

Stupid!

For two islands!

I would have said:
one for you and one for me,

and bugger off.

Right?

Like yesterday,

two airplanes, these two jets
that cost 3 billion.

I wouldn't spend it
on airplanes.

I would spend it
to have a nice life.

With 3 billion
I'd make a beautiful life, not war.

What does
a beautiful like look like for you?

I would buy a house in the country,

with a pool,

without working,

with my girlfriend
I would go to the pool,

stay there...

until seven, then we'd go back home.

We would shower together,

we would wash together,

so she washes me and I wash her,

then we would eat, watch TV,

then go to bed and make love.

Is that the good life?

What?

That's a good life.

- For me, yes.
- For me too?

For others, I don't know.

Me, about drugs...

I know that it is a bad thing.

And that all men on earth
are drug addicts, all!

I would say there are
different types of drugs.

There is the syringe,
and the drug that you smoke.

But there is another drug...

that makes you think ugly things,

makes you think about things
that won't happen to you.

All those thoughts...

then... I am a drug addict,

I am a drug addict, and I admit it.

Which drug?

I smoke.

When my mother smokes,

I am drugged, because...

I breathe a gas
that hurts my mother,

and automatically hurts me too.

Understood?

Me and school,
we don't get along very well.

Why?

Because I don't like it.

How would you like the school to be?

Study yes, that's obvious.

but also...

play, play!

Play all day.

And what else?

Come on, tell me about school.

It's that...

it's boring, always studying.

There is only half an hour of recess.

At noon, one hour.

Not very well organized.

And besides... school is like...

being in cage.

Also,

you can't live at school, you can't...

play, you can't make love, right?

So...

for me, school is a load of shit.

And then,

you know,
when the teacher calls you,

you screw it
because you haven't studied,

and you get a bad mark.

That has nothing to do with life.

The notes...

all that has nothing to do with life.

Life is about love,
pleasure, happiness...

Discover life!

Shout...

I want to live!

I want to be free! Go to China,
to America, to the US, to New York.

To all corners of the world.

This is how you discover

that in the world there are other...

other...

ways to think.

I'm going to ask you
one last question.

Why do you think...

that children are treated
in such a strange way by adults?

As if they were fools?

because older people
believe that children...

we don't know how to do anything.

And it is not like that?

When they want, children are
superior to adults.

Because they have
another way of thinking.

They imagine
prettier things, purer things,

but the elders have malice.

Like you!

Look, I'm going to tell you
one thing, I did the street only once,

I did it once,
and it was enough to say:

enough,
I won't do the sidewalk anymore.

I wanted to try it,
to be part of my story,

and half an hour
was enough to say: enough!

Tell me what happened
in that half hour?

Yes...

then, it was a time when...

I was very much hooked on drugs,
but not any more,

other than that...

and... I saw the opportunity,
you understand?

They told me: "I give you
200 and a gold chain if...

you let yourself be groped
for half an hour"

That was more than OK with me...

So, I drank
two bottles of wine before,

I was... completely loaded.

And then we went

to this guy's house.

He groped me,

but he saw I was drunk.

Every five minutes
I asked him the time.

And then, you know,
those old men, there,

those old pigs, those swines,

barely they see a naked woman,
and they start to drool.

Because they are totally...
castrated.

What...

So he gave me 200,

plus a gold chain,

which I went to sell immediately
and I bought...

a dress and a pair of shoes.

And well,

I thought about spending it all
on drugs but, well,

I took a small examination of conscience
and bought only a little bit of stuff.

60 worth or so.

So he didn't want to make love to you?

No, no, he wanted that because,

they are the ones who make demands,
you understand?

And you tell them: "Yes, okay,

it's fine, whatever you want"

Also, I remember I left on a bicycle.

"Do you let your self be groped,
do you let yourself ..."

Yes, come on,
it's your money that interests me!

Well, then he was fondling me.

And how old was he?

He was 62 years old.

For me, tenderness,

I don't know how to tell you,
what do I know...

Try to give me...

a hand.

Tenderness...

Help me out... at least...

because I've got it in my head,
understand?

But when I have to talk about it,

I get stuck.

Ana,

if you have to teach a girl,
who knows nothing about love,

trying to teach her,
what would you say?

To a woman...
that is something that...

to make love with a man,

especially today,

is a bit difficult.

A woman, to make love
to a man should very much...

make use of her hands.

Learn to do it right,

to caress a man.

That is to say?

Caress the entire body.

Not to...

only the consummated act.

That is a thing,

according to me,

which really comes
at the last moment.

But what kind of caresses?
Explain it to me.

My God...

Delicate caresses,

do it delicately, to sum it up.

As delicately as possible.

Could you show how to do it
on your cheek?

No, on the cheek, impossible.

- Well, on your arm.
- There you go.

As lightly as possible,

with the fingertips.

Yes, with the fingertips.

- And the same for the whole body?
- Yes

Especially on the most delicate
points, the most sensitive.

- What do you mean? Which are?
- Oh God...

- Behind the ears?
- Behind the ears.

And what else?

Under the armpits,

on the breasts,

and what else?

And over here, and below.

On the penis?

- Yes, and going down.
- Towards the testicles?

- True?
- Yes

And... after the caresses?

Afterwards, a man when...

he reaches...

when you see that...

That he feels pleasure,
you can make love, obviously.

Listen, try to tell me,
using your imagination,

how...

you prepare to go to the station,

come on, tell me about one of
your evenings at the station.

I'd prepare to go to
the station and I'd try to...

to get as beautiful as possible

get me a permanent,

I put on makeup,

and before that I took a bath,

and then I'd comb my hair,
I'd put on makeup,

and after that I'd go.

- I'd arrive...
- What time?

well... not always
at the same time,

It depended on whether I was
ready that evening, it depended...

I had no one who...

set a schedule for me.

Tell me in what other ways...

men liked to get pleasure
and to give it to you?

well, they really liked
that a woman...

would do, for example... a 69

That is to say?

Why, you don't know?

With the mouth.

That is to say, how... how...

- But how, you don't know?
- I know, but you, how did you do it?

Like all the others, only...

I didn't manage this trick
to have it all the way in the mouth.

- To swallow it?
- No.

Did you have a special technique?

No, for example,
when a man was about to come,

instead of... he'd get out.

- What do you mean?
- Get out suddenly, do like this.

What did you do to him?

I lick it with my tongue,
so that he'd come over my belly.

and he'd come like that,
it was something more...

Listen, what if a 15 year
old boy wanted to do it?

I didn't do it with kids,

because my children came to mind.

And how old was the youngest
you have done it with?

He would have been...

a little over 19 years, I have
never done it with someone younger.

And they didn't know anything
about love?

Yes, they were...

they had no idea how to make love.

They were still naive.

What would you like to tell me
about your life?

About my life...

I'll tell you this:
One time, I went with a guy,

to a field,

and I made love with a screwdriver...

That is to say?

I made him come
with his work tools.

Let's see, explain it to me!
That is a good one.

It's a good one, right?

And so?

There was only one screwdriver
on the work table,

and I made use of it.

I'd like you to explain,
I don't understand it at all.

Come on,
I have to explain everything to you.

Yes.

You took the screwdriver?

Yeah, I hit him with the screwdriver.

I beat his testicles, like that.

- With the screwdriver?
- Yes, but softly, not hard.

And then?

He came.

But why did he want to make love
with a screwdriver?

But it was me who told him: "I want
to try to make you come like this."

- And he?
- I wanted to try it anyway.

Interesting.

What's interesting?

OK, how many and which
means did you use to make a man come?

All means. Sometimes
they came with a whip,

there are sadists.

That is to say?

One time for example,
there was someone,

who wanted...

that a woman pooped in his mouth.

And I have done it!

- Did you poop in his mouth?
- Yes, yes!

- But really... you don't believe me?
- Yes, yes...

Because otherwise
I wouldn't tell you.

You see, that thing, it's an
experience that I will never repeat.

And afterwards he wanted to go
to the police and tell everything...

because I had done him too little...

So I told my friend: "Next time,
I will give him a laxative,

and you will be the one to go."

Tell me what he said.

I swear I was stunned,
because this had never happened to me.

When he told me... to...

leave a big message in his mouth,

I told him that I didn't know
how to do that...

I'll do it in the bidet,
and then I'll...

I'll carry it in a napkin,
because how could I do it?

But he, with his hands,

he totally fouled up the hotel bed.

And later,
when I asked for a room again,

They told me: "Sorry, but
I don't give it to you anymore,

because you left me quite a job."

You see, that was something
that I couldn't...

I could not explain
that king of thing to those people.

That he had been the one...

How old was he?

He would be... about fifty years old,

His name was Sadrico,
a name that suited him well...

- Sadrico?
- Sadrico...

And you know what he did for a living?

No, what he did, I didn't ask him.

And what did he say?
Could you poo in my mouth?

Yes, exactly like that.

And I told him, wait,
that's something that's never...

been asked of me, is it possible
that you want me to do that?

It seemed to me something completely...

I told him, if that's what you want,
it's less work for me...

and when I started,
I felt like vomiting.

- Did you feel like vomiting?
- Yes, I swear!

And after doing this, did he eat it?

Yes, yes, he ate it, he enjoyed it.

And did he come?

It was obvious that he came like that.

How you do...

to, let's say...

attract the customer?

I was terrified when I had to
entice the first one.

For me, the hardest thing was
to get the first customer,

I didn't even know where to start,
and then...

when I got the first one, then...

it went well with the others.

Were you afraid of
the first one every day?

Yes, it was always the first one...

Why did you get scared like this?

Who knows why, that's how it was.

And each time...

that I had to be with a...

that I had to do it with the
first client, that happened to me.

- Do you dream Anna?
- Yes, often.

Could you tell me one?

I always dream...

about the dead.

That I talk with them, that...

I see them as if they were alive.

And what do they tell you?

Often,

we talk about money, we talk about...

that kind of thing, but when...

I want to talk about things...

say something nicer, they
disappear and I don't see them any more.

What would you like to ask
a dead man?

Well, I'd want to ask a lot of things.

Like which?

You know, how are you up there?

If there is Paradise,
to ask a lot of things.

Hell...

How do you imagine hell?

Me, hell, imagine it is...

not being able to see God,
the deprivation of God.

That must be hell.

How do you see God?

I see God as...

a very beautiful person,

blonde,

with blue eyes,

and long hair.

Did you ever meet a person
who looks like...

like the image you have of God?

No.

Tell me, what is your opinion of men?

Well...

Men are all a bit the same.

They only think about having fun,

and when making love

they are completely different.

The next day at 3 pm,

Ana was found dead after ingesting
a bottle of muriatic acid.

44 years old, prostitute.

No investigation.

OF LOVE YOU LIVE

End of part 1

Of love you live

Second part

Gloria and Lola

- I start?
- Yes, when you want.

Tobacco is a...

Tobacco and the fan...

they are poison for the voice.

Why didn't you want to be a singer,
with such a beautiful voice?

Bah, I would have wanted,

if I wasn't a certain age.

I'd still want to be today.

Why couldn't you do it?

Because of the fact that...

that I am a transsexual!

Tell me the first night of love
with your great Italian love.

With my Italian love?

He was from Sardinia.

He already knew who I was.

He already knew I was...

We met...

frequently, several months.

And than it became
a night of love that lasted 6 years.

As of that day,
we didn't separate anymore.

He was married and had five children.

We became crazy about each other,
that was a catastrophe...

Him because of the fact...

that he had
left his wife and all that.

Me, with parents who...

It was a real romance.

And how would you
summarize this romance?

Well, the summary is
that it all ended in a soap bubble.

He returned to his wife.

Maybe, if I had been a woman,
he would not have left me.

I'm sure of that.

And did his wife talk to you?

If she talked?
She rather shouted.

And you two did could not get along?

She and me?

Bah... the poor one, go figure.

A mother of 5 children and
the husband leaves her for me.

It was not her fault.

How did you decide, later on,

to prostitute yourself,
to do the sidewalks?

As if I could do something else!
Who would give me work?

Who accepts me in a supermarket?

At Tati's,
at the Galeries Lafayette... who?

And then, not even talking about that,
for a lot of other reasons.

What kind of man do you like?
Who is your ideal man?

Uff... the ideal man,
the ideal man...

I can tell you that...

the only two men in my life were...

big, brown, Latin type.

But then, I'm not looking for that,

even if I find an older man,

who takes care of me,

I don't care,
I'm not looking for beauty.

Even as if he were
the last of garbage collectors.

- But are you lonely?
- Yes.

And how do you fight it?

I suffer from loneliness since...

I was 3 years old, since I lost my
mother, it went downhill.

And I fight it... as you see,
with the crochet hook,

with music, and my lyrics.

When I'm in good voice, I sing.

Tell me, but this passion for art...

- It's a passion.
- It's something innate.

...in someone born
with the desire to be a woman.

Ah yes, I was, let's say...
I was a child,

I remember that at 10,
the first experience I had

with the lyrics, I was in the street,
there was a record shop,

next to the Regio theatre.

I passed by...

and I heard a voice,

of a soprano,

who sang Mimi's Aria,
[La Bohème]

right at this point:
"When the thaw comes..."

I was 10 years old... I got goosebumps.

From then on, for me, lyrics were...

one of my reasons to live.

I love lyrics.

Here we have Callas, my baby.

A wonderful woman,
there will never be another one.

Hey Gloria, can you tell me...

one of your evenings?
How do you do it, you out, and...?

I get out of here, I get in
front of the door and...

and I hope they come by.

And they talk about money.
Sorry?

- Do you have regular customers?
- Yes, yes.

And what
do they tell you then, nothing?

They come here?

Like with a woman.

And the act lasts, on average?

It depends...

3 minutes, 4, 5,
a quarter of an hour...

half an hour, it depends
on their availability.

And your availability, is it absolute,

or is it limited?

You know, in this field, there
really is no...

if you find a guy who...

is generous to you,
so much the better,

there is nothing preset.

But what can they do with your body,
do you impose limits or...

do you clearly demarcate availability?

No, there is absolute availability.

Is that so?

Tell me, if you should teach
a housewife ..

to make love,
to be affectionate, tender,

what would you advise her?

Well, I would advise her...

to be very...

above all, not to be vulgar.

Not vulgar, very cuddly,
very vivacious, very innocent.

In practice, do you do
what any prostitute does?

- Yes, yes...
- What do you do, do you wash him?

No, no, he knows how to do that alone

Do you put a condom on him?

Sometimes yes, sometimes not...

And how do you decide
to put it or not?

Well, I put it
if it's a dirty person.

If a dirty person comes, I put it.

And do you know that
because you know him?

No... you feel that,
the smell, everything...

Above all, I'm telling you,
there are few men who wash themselves.

Moreover, it's humiliating, because
they are the ones who do it with us.

The fact of not washing...

maybe, if they went
with an honest girl...

perhaps they'd wash.

And that is even more humiliating
than smelling their stench.

You tell them
"Why don't you wash yourself?"

Yes, yes, I tell them.

And then?

Bah... then they wash...

Could you tell me,
how do you do it with a man?

With a man? Well... normal...

That is to say?

Well...
a normal relationship with a man...

like with a woman...

Do you undress?

I take off my clothes...

I sit on the bed, he approaches,
he caresses my shoulders, my breasts...

and then throws me back,

kisses me a little...

Our job is not to let too much be done,

otherwise they hold on for hours.

And then, what happens?

Eh... they make you loose time.

If they also want...
to lick your sex for example?

Yes, of course...

And you, do you let them do it?

Yes, provided it doesn't last forever.

And if there's one
who wants to make you come?

That's impossible.
How could he make me come?

If he does... fellatio on you?

To me?

But if I am operated,
he does it were, fellatio?

- Ah! Are you operated.
- Sure!

- Have you taken it away?
- Oh yeah!

I did it in Casablanca.

- Ah, you did this famous...
- Hey yes, I did.

Ah... And what did you feel
when you woke up?

A great freedom...

of being able to move...

the way I feel like.

At the beach,

at home, with family,

wherever...

In practice,
do you have a female organ?

Yes, at least... outwardly.

Tell me, when a man
comes inside of you...

- does that give you pleasure?
- Not at all.

- Not even something?
- No, but I don't care,

maybe it's the age... I don't know.

Bit did you prostitute yourself
before the operation?

Before the operation? No

No... I sang.

And how much did this operation cost?

Well... it cost me... about
700,000 old francs,

it was still in old francs,

now we have the new franc.

Tell me, due to the fact of
losing your member...

- ...these changes have taken place?
- No, I haven't lost it.

I had it removed, I haven't lost it.

Well... they have withdrawn it,
do you agree ...?

Yes.

That your member was removed,
didn't that create hormonal imbalances?

Physiological?

No, no... nothing.

Because they removed
everything, the testicles...

Everything.

I felt better, immediately better.

On the other hand,
I've spent my life falling in love.

But do you love yourself?

- Me?
- Yes

For what I am, no

I would have wanted to be a woman, yes.

I am not like some people
who accept this state...

On the one hand
I accept it, but if...

if it had not been like that,
it would have been better.

Because it creates such problems...

That is to say?

From the social point of view.

We, for example, are...

transsexuals.

This means we are born...

women.

From every point of view,
mentally, everything.

And we would like to be women.

And our sexual relations...

For example, me, I'd never imagine...

being active.

To take the active part.

That's something that disgusts me,
which I don't accept.

The man who comes with me
must consider me as a woman.

You understand?
That's the true transsexual.

And then there are the transvestites...

which from the start we have been,
us too,

with a different state of mind,
but well...

Those who want
to remain transvestites...

who are almost proud to have a member,

those are the real transvestites.

It's a homosexual,
more effeminate than virile.

And then there is the homosexual...

The homosexual does not
desire to be a woman.

They are happy
the way they are, and that's it.

and accept it like it is,
which is right to them.

And then there are...

It's a bit of a rough word, but hey...

there is the paedophile.

The paedophile who loves young boys.

And this is something...

which is not nice.

Well, you understand,
with all that, people...

treat us...

all in the same way.

The paedophile, or the homosexual,

or more vulgar, faggots.

They put us all in the same bag!

Tell me Gloria, and you? Have
you also had plastic surgery?

The nose, yes.

- Not bad right?
- No

It came out as it came out...

Tell me,
the secret of striptease, what is it?

The secret... bah, that's innate too,

there is not much to learn,
you do it well or you don't.

Me, I do stripteases
very elegantly, with dance,

with sweet... music.

I don't like dirty stripteases,

too... sensual.

too much focused on sex.

Because for me,
a striptease should be...

a girl who shows her body,

that must be something... beautiful,

not dirty.

There was a woman did
a striptease dressed as a nun.

- A woman, or...
- A woman.

Dressed as a nun.

And she dressed or undressed?

She was dressed as a nun.

And then?

And then he passed
a crucifix everywhere,

over breasts, over her buttocks...

scandalous.

And in this case...

What can you tell me about tenderness?

Well, I can say
that tenderness is a great thing.

that... we feel it most of all when
we are children, after that it's over.

Describe me:
how do you imagine your future?

My future?

My future, I don't expect much.

I will end alone,

in this house,

I don't see a great future.

A future of loneliness.

Like most of us.

not to say all of us.

Of this love...

this love that throbs...

of the universe...

of the whole universe,

mysterious,

mysterious all over.

Agony,

agony and delight,

agony and delight,

delight of the heart.

OF LOVE YOU LIVE

OF LOVE YOU LIVE
LOLA

You are thirsty, not hungry...

Lola, why...

tell me.

- Do you always feed them like that?
- No, only when they are orphans.

- Ah, those two are orphans.
- Yes, the father is dead, poisoned.

By what?

By pollution.

They don't have any alternative.

They are so helpless, you see.

There's a lot of
tenderness between you.

Yes.

There's a lot of love,
I love them so much.

I can't imagine to eat them.

Tell me, Lola,
this strong love for animals...

do you apply that to human beings?
- Yes.

They are animals too.

The difference is that
these are entirely good,

human beings,
to the contrary, are not.

Do you love them?

- To these two orphans or animals?
- Animals.

The animal interests me a lot,
as an indicative

of how man could be
if he didn't live in a cage.

Tell me, you say that this love,
you also applies it to people.

Do you live with someone,
do you live alone?

No! I live with my husband.

- For how long?
- 12 years.

Life as a couple looked like
a very hard thing to me.

It is true...

Yes.

Also made of arguments, of lies...

I think I have come to understand why.

Because there is
no freedom in marriage.

But there are obligations,

Eat at noon, pretty dresses, nice car,

if we dropped these values,
we would live better.

- At least for my part.
- And jealousy?

I am not jealous.

I am not jealous

And he?

I think he isn't either.

Then you will quarrel much less?

We argue much less...

but when we argue,
we really do it!

Tell me,
between a couple you get sometimes...

a phenomenon of sexual boredom.

Yes.

Has this also happened
to you and your husband?

Yes,

to him, in relation to me.

- And not to you?
- No.

Because I am very focused on sex,

also regarding to him.

Can you tell me, how he pleased you,

your first night of love
with your husband?

Yes, I'm happy to tell you,
because it was very beautiful.

I met him in a bar,

we looked at each other, we went to bed
together and we didn't separate anymore.

It was very nice, we loved
each other, I was very young,

- and we are still together.
- But, tell me, you are very young?

I'm 30, I met him when I was 17.

Look at the male!

Listen Lola,

tell me one thing, but...

other aspect...

difficult for the couple, is monogamy.

Are you monogamous?

Or... do you also have
other experiences?

I also have other experiences.

I am not made for monogamy

He too?

He is more of a coward

That is to say?

He favours monogamy but...

my conscience decides
to have other experiences.

He does it secretly,

and he won't have
the courage to tell me...

and I do not like that,
but that's how it is.

Tell me, there is in women,
in general, a series of...

propensities, right?

For example
the propensity to motherhood.

- Did you never feel that instinct?
- No.

- Never?
- Never.

- Did you never want to have a child?
- I have one!

- You have one?
- Yes.

And so?

No I could use a cigarette.

- Do you want to smoke?
- Yes.

Let's go back a little,

tell me... your encounter

with your great love,
with your husband...

tell me about that meeting
and that night of love.

No, that is mine.

It is yours, but...

it still belongs to you
even if you tell me...

- It would belong to me less...
- to the contrary.

No... it would belong to you too.

Tell me with dignity,
it becomes...

- something universal.
- Yes.

You are trying to convince me...

- No, I want...
- It's that, you see...

I only want the best for you.

it fades away... so many years
have passed since that,

and these days our relationship
has changed so much that...

in a certain way I feel bad...
thinking about it again,

because it was so beautiful,
I was so young...

I was very beautiful...
very beautiful,

I had everything to offer,

and he gave me everything,
I remember.

That we went into the house...

of one of his friends,
an empty house,

those empty houses,
but inhabited...

in his small bed...

I found myself in his arms,

I loved him, he loved me,

I had the impression of being
in paradise,

and with this image of my big
love that I've always remembered.

years went by.

But I always preserve this image.

- Do you understand what I want to say?
- Yes.

But it is not always so clear...

But did love grow numb, or has it...

diminished?

it has taken a different form.

Which?

It's like when...

you look at the moon...

on a post card,

and then you see it with a telescope...

I am below, understand?

I see all this love, all this life,

right now it's indestructible.

Have you ever been afraid
of losing him?

No, I will never lose him,
even if he leaves.

Those are stupid theories,

it's like youth,
theoretically you don't lose it,

because it stays inside of you.

I think that youth,
you acquire it while losing it,

because it stays inside of you,

all your youth, so while you live it,
you lose it and...

and you don't even realize.

The experience of
motherhood, did you want it?

No.

Why?

Bah, me and a pregnancy, what a joke.

It is continuity,
not motherhood

Have you never wanted to have a child?

I told you that I have one!

How is that?

At 16 I was with a girl,
whom I appreciated a lot,

she was 10 years older than me,

and baf!
we had a baby...

It was a girl,
she took her way, I mine...

I know I have created a continuity,
just like my doves who reproduce.

And you never see her, this girl?

Everyday, she is inside of me.

I'm not interested to see her in person,

I know she is here.

Haven't you seen her again?

The last time I saw her
was 3 or 4 years ago,

but those are things that...

in an instant...

are beyond you, given the time
I've been without seeing her.

If I see her again in 4 or 5 years...

it will be the same.

She doesn't need me,
and I don't need her.

You could say that that is true love?

Yes.

You have to see what people
understand by 'love'.

It's not buying a brioche for a kid
every 5 minutes.

That is not love.

Well, for me, love, you know...

it is a choice,

an availability.

- It's the choice for an availability...
- Unlimited.

I have given a lot of love,

and I will still give a lot.

right now it's you
whom I'm giving it to.

But I give it to you too.

Yes.

I feel it.

- And do you make love a lot?
- A lot.

Is it a central element in your life?

Yes.

Tell me something, how... how...

does your sexual experience occur,

what does it consist of?

In taking...

the best in a man,
not only what's between his legs.

Sex is the umbilical cord
that links me to another person.

And there are things that...

for example, between your and me,
would be much clearer in bed.

And things that are much clearer
if we don't go there.

It is often useful for me...

this thing...

to... to try different things.

- To know you.
- To know me, it's a method.

Tell me, the man in general,

especially the Italian man,
he has this obsession,

of entering his penis at all costs...

It's a castration...

But you, do you manage to establish
a true relationship through sex,

a true corporal relationship?

Yes... it's an equilibrium.

And how do you teach it to your
partner, what do you say to him?

With the eyes, with the hair,

with gestures.

If I suddenly stand up,
you lift the camera.

Do you understand what I want to say?

Yes, I understand, but if he,
for example, doesn't know anything?

He learns it,

over time.

Well, do me a favor,
if for example... a housewife...

asked you: "Please, advise me,
what should I do...

to make love?"

I really would not know
what to say to a housewife...

a housewife...

these are things that are not taught,
they are learnt alone.

And those different elements, which
are tenderness, sexuality and love,

do you see them as a whole
or as different elements?

They are like atoms, molecules, which
are sometimes apart and sometimes united,

and often they form one whole.

Perhaps I asked you questions
which bothered you?

Well... in general, all of them a bit,

because I feel...

a bit of discomfort.

You rattle me...

I have never
opened up like this to anyone.

Tell me a story,
one that comes to mind,

a story about...

love conquest,

in which you have conquered
the love of a man.

That's not always easy.

I have never conquered a man.

I have conquered a moment,
a way of life,

I have conquered my husband,
and all has to do with him.

I have lived with his mother,
I have loved him,

I have seen him grow old,

grow fatter.

That is the conquest of love.

When you see a person change,

when you see her lose her teeth,

when she had to go to the dentist
because she needs a denture,

For me, that is love.

Well, partly.

Yes, but there you have my conquest,

watch him grow old, go bald...

It is not a conquest,
to put someone in your bed...

or love him.
Yes, that too, but...

beauty comes later, when you manage
to get beyond those things.

Like when a pigeon
suddenly she shits on me.

To tolerate it...

even not tolerating it,
finding out that it's a natural thing...

then you can live with it.

You can't raise doves
if the shit bothers you.

- So we cannot love anymore?
- Eh, no.

To love, to live together,
you first have to...

also love everything else.

I really want to ask you a question:

According to you, what do humans
hide behind their doors?

Why are house doors closed?

Because nobody has the courage
to open them.

It's a bit as if...

each door were a small mafia.

Behind those doors is anguish,

disobedience, desires.

A bit like the doors...

from Dante's Hell,

when he makes the trip to hell.

But there are also beautiful doors,

not all doors are closed.

But I... I don't want to go
through these doors,

me, my door is open.

Tell me Lola, you have...

written poetry?

Yes.

Tell me one, one that you hold dear.

I write essays... for
example I have written one about love,

about sexuality.

And I imagined it...

as an open doorway,

full of flowers,

where anyone can enter
to take his pick,

attracted by the colors.

I imagine this door half open,

that's why... to enter, you
have to close or open it a little more

and then you have to make a choice.

There it is... that's an essay
about my sexuality.

About others, not mine!

and from now on,
behind that doorway,

there are no more beautiful flowers.

they have trampled on them.

You understand?

But flowers have that wonderful
pig-headedness to be reborn incessantly.

Yes, it's true.

The more you trample them,

the more they are reborn
in the following spring.

What you tell me is very beautiful,
it gives me a little more hope.

And then, there are many poems that...

Poems, we all write them, mine are...

I wanted to write a book in
the style of the Gospel,

because I really like the Gospel.

It is one of the books I have
read, that has stricken me the most.

Tell me, then...
do you just like the Gospel,

- or are you a believer?
- As well.

Also, a lot.

so tell me something
that interests me a lot,

describe me how you see
the figure of God.

Huge!

Covering everything.

Without ever leaving us,

who is here, who is there,

who is up there and down here.

It was never a problem
for me to see him,

because when you know
that something exists,

there's no need to...

rummage, as they say.

I feel him.

I feel that he protects me.

In spite of the fact

that one can smile...

at the idea that God would protect me,

because of my way of life.

But people are always wrong,

or almost.

Now I am going to tell you something
that is a great sacrilege for people...

In my sexual throes
I have also desired God...

because he is part of me,

and I am part of him.

And this desire
I imagine as the Holy Spirit.

And the Virgin?

The final hug.

But orgasm,

how does it express itself with you?

Like a volcano...

Describe me
in the most accurate words possible...

what happens to you
when you reach orgasm?

A volcano, I told you.
When it emerges, it reaches the zenith.

It reaches the top,
but it is at the beginning...

it's the end of a beginning.

You understand?

- Like the promise of the next?
- Yes.

- Because orgasm, it's a search.
- Also.

Me, I get drained with my orgasms.

Now that it's hot,

I'm not very interested
in reaching orgasm,

and I really like masturbating alone,

it's a wonderful thing.

Especially because your partner often...

distracts you from your thoughts,

or you force yourself to do things
that you don't feel like doing.

I like that, to masturbate.

I like it when I wake up,
or during the night,

I always get excited.

Then my thoughts... explode.

The split up.

A thought about such a thing,
a thought about another...

a thought about me,

my body excites me at certain times,

my sexuality...

End then...

all that unites, explodes,

and I start masturbating.

And then I give my orgasm
to such or such thing,

one time to God, one time to myself,

one time to my husband,

shortly also one for you,
because you excite me.

That's is, my orgasm.

But the duration of this experience
has no limits?

Often it lasts long, sometimes
it's short, it depends.

And then I...

I analyze it later.

if I fall asleep it is because
I liked it, and then I dream...

If I repeat,
it is because it did not go well.

Does a dream come to mind that
interested you specifically?

I have them always in mind,
continuously.

I dream... a lot about potatoes.

I dream of potatoes in the clouds.

That intrigues me a lot,
I don't know why...

I have those dreams...

Describe the dream to me.

Before he died I dreamed of
Paul VI in a cloud,

talking with John XXIII.

And later when Albino Luciani
died (John Paul I),

two days before I dreamed
about him on a cloud, talking

with Paul VI and John XXII.

Successively, I dream of all
of them before they die.

You see?

Let's say they... had a bit
of the same characteristics.

But about the last one
you have never dreamed?

The one right now?

No, because he doesn't interest me much.

And perhaps also
because it's not yet his time to die.

But the Pope, do you
dream about him dressed in white?

Yes, he is always
dressed as Pope, in white.

But I live well
with these dreams of mine...

because I managed to synchronize them.

When I dream of horses,
it's because I have to travel.

When I dream of bills of money,
it's because I earn a lot.

When I dream of coins,
it's because I'm losing.

As I told you.
I have an animal instinct.

Animals know how to do
many things that...

others do not know how to do.
I am like that,

I know many things
that others do not know,

and I am unable to do the things
that everybody does.

Look, I'm going to ask you
a question about animals:

do you think that
it's possible for an animal...

that it could give its affection
in exchange for food or protection?

No, no... animal prostitution?

No, that does not exist

Tell me, has it happened to you,
for example...

have to gotten to the point of...

Prostituting myself to eat?

Not to eat,
because I am like the animals,

I know how to find food
without prostituting myself.

I have prostituted myself for
reasons that make no sense,

the rest, they prostitute themselves
for reasons that make no sense.

- You mean, for futile reasons?
- Yes.

But why, out of anguish?

No, not out of anguish,
that's a good excuse.

For example those mothers,

that one become a whore
to feed her children,

maybe the first time she uses
that excuse, and then...

she feeds her children
but with the rest

she dresses herself,
does other things...

Prostitute yourself to eat, as far
as I'm concerned, I've never seen it.

Have you ever been hit?

Yes.

Tell me.

My father, very often.

Why?

Because I liked to make myself up,

because from a young age
I wanted to become independent.

But I have already forgotten it.

I have never hit anyone.

If others have done it to me,
never mind.

Tell me in what terms

do you feel the obstacle
of the male mentality?

It is the word "Man" that bothers me.

And when I hear "I am a man",

or "I don't fight him
because he is a child",

"I respect him
because he is an old man",

I'm tired of things like that.

And my husband tires me when he says,

or when he thinks of himself as a man.

I would like to live with him
because he is...

a being, not a man.

let's call him "Person",
is that OK with you?

Yes.

- "The person".
- Perfect.

I am not a woman,
and I don't want to be.

I'm not a man either,

like the other men.

We should find a suitable terminology,

neither transsexual, nor hermaphrodite.

We are small meteorites,
who fall on the earth.

It's not that I'd want to be a weirdo,

or that I'd want to be an idol.

We are flamboyant, very beautiful.

What the world instrumentalizes,

there are those who castrate themselves,
who want to become a woman,

to reach a rational...

goal.

Because society wants...

to compartmentalize.

I think I'm one of the few...

who has remained what she is,

and who wants to live
for what she is.

Because I want to piss with my penis,

not with an artificial vagina.

Generally, women don't touch men,

they expect to be touched.

Because they are stupid!

You see, it's really from the start,

if you approach a man and touch him,

sexually,

he will almost never dominate you.

If on the contrary it is he
who behaves like this with a woman,

it's an act of submission,

and I think he will
dominate you all your life.

It's a theory of mine.

From the moment I decided
to touch men,

I never let myself submit,
that was my choice.

Mostly, women allow men
to make this decision,

but this gesture,

it's like... a contract.

Throughout life, they will have
to let themselves be touched,

and let themselves be dominated.

Because "Man" was born...

and the woman submitted.

Okay Lola, one last question:

improvise for me,

as well as you can,

a declaration of love.

I like your hair,

I like your neglected side,

and in this instant
I have loved you so much,

and I will never forget you.

That's it.

And hopefully you always remember me.

Even when you're not next to a camera.

OF LOVE YOU LIVE

THANKS TO THE U.S.L. 4 PARMA,
IN PARTICULAR TO ENZO VINCENZI

THE POPULATION OF PARMA

AND TO MARIO TOMMASINI
WHO INSPIRED THIS RESEARCH