A Story of Sahel Sounds (2016) - full transcript

I'll make some more coffee.

That's why I was on the Computer,
I was waiting to

talk to Maciek,
we had a 9 o'clock Skypechat,

about going to Africa.

we were supposed to go to Mali together
and we decided to go to Timbuktu,

and then...

lately, he was like "I don't know
if I really want to go to Mali anymore"

Why? Because things are still weird?

Yeah,
because people got killed in Bamako...

I don't know, I think Mali is fine,
as long as you don't go to the Nightclubs.

I thought it was save?



I mean, nothing is really ever save, but...

yeah Bamako typically is save, but...
-I want a knife.

You want a knife?
-No I'm good.

Mark me down for 46 "Balani".

I got three "Saharan Cellphones Part II".

These are mine, these "Takamba"
and "Alkibar". Oh, these are yours!

-The "Laila"?
-Yes. So there are four of those.

I got a lot of this "Harafinso" record.

That's the only record you guys
ever put out, either of you,

that I just don't like.

Even the "robot-music"?

You don't like the little
autotune, robotic sounds?

I think there's one song,
one song that's okay.

But it kind of bums me out.



I feel like that record just...

People really like it more in
northern Nigeria than anywhere else,

there's a reason it's regional.

Alright...there's one,

so it's 46.

There's one of three, so 53.

The harsh toke is that,
if you're going to do good work,

if the odds are good,
that you won't make money.

If you want to make money,
you have to do shitty work,

or screw someone over,

or do something terrible.
Somebody has to die,

some blood has to be shed,
in order for you to profit.

That's just the way of the world,

like "Diamonds on the soles of her shoes".

It's just…that's the way of the world.

To be unsuccessful is noble,

to be broke is noble, as far as I can tell.

I could be wrong about this, but...

I hope I'm not.

Never keep any money on your bank account
and always turn it into new records.

Right now I've just written
a bunch of checks

and then I looked
at my bank account,

well, "as long as you don't cash it in
today and wait till tomorrow…"

Because I tried to put
as much in production as I can,

like everything, everything I have.

I don't want any money
ever in my bank account.

Yeah, never keep money
in your bank account

is the number one rule
of surviving all this business.

And no fear, just assume everything
is going to work out magically somehow

and then it will be fine.

I like this song.

If I had an example of somebody doing this

and really making a living from it,
it would be easier.

And doing
like a record label professionally and...

that's okay. But I know if I start
having a family that I'm supporting to,

that I might make these decisions, that

I need to make more
and I'm paying the musicians less.

And I don't want to become one of those
old-school-world-music-label-guys,

in those big institutional,
exploitative industries.

That's not the model I want to be on.

I think that I've continued
to keep doing this, because

every year
things seem to be getting better.

Not from a financial standpoint, but
from a publicity standpoint, from press.

The label is been getting
more attention every year,

we are doing more interviews,
more opportunities.

And as those things keep happening,
I've sort of reluctantly kept on.

Every year there has been
a moment where I said,

"Okay, I'm going to just
quit doing this and get a job",

but I've held on
because of these little successes,

not big successes, but little ones.

Yeah, we got Chris Kirkley, Sahel Sounds,
stepping up for the mix - Sahel Sounds!

It's warm.

Are you Hama? -Yes.
Okay, you're Hama.

I've searched for you for ages.

People in Agadez told me
your name is "Japonais"?

No, they don't know who I am...

They use the name "Japonais Sosa".

Yes, but they don't know it's me.
But it's me.

It's you!
-I'm the only one who does this.

What do you play with? Which piano?
-Yamaha.

Yamaha?

It's a Yamaha that I use

for composing beats.

I see.

I've been looking for you since 2012.

Right.
-I discovered your music on a bus.

I was leaving Gao
right when the rebellion started,

I was on my way to Niamey and I heard
your music on the bus, on a cell phone.

It's similar to Ethiopian music.

People think
it's either Ethiopian or Arabic, or...

I thought it was
someone from Tamanrasset.

So I called Tamanrasset,
then I called Agadez...

Since 2012!

That's a long time.

I'm working right now...
-You are?

Yes, I leave at 7 pm.

7 pm. OK.
-7 pm, 7:30 pm.

Maybe we call you later this evening?
-Sure.

When you're ready, give me a call.

I will get the piano ready.

When you come you can listen.
-That's good.

Great.
-Cool. I'll take your number as well.

My name is Christopher.
-Christopher.

It's Hama?

H-A-M-A.
-Yes.

Like this?
-Yes, like this.

P.

P for...
-P for "piano".

So that you know...

It's good to wear this,
it will protect you from the sun.

I don't have much hair left anyways...

No no, that is...
-I will get as red as this.

That's for sure.

In the States you have a lot of snow.

But here there is no snow,
we have volcanoes.

Yeah, it's like that.

OK, I don't want to keep you. Thanks.

Thank you very much.
-Have a nice day.

What's up?
Niamey is a lake instead of a city.

There's water everywhere, it's weird.

We're going to go to Agadez.
There's no water there, right?

It's the desert, right?

That's good. I hate this lake here.

It's not good.

OK, let's do that. I'll call you soon.

CENTER FOR MUSIC EDUCATION
AND MUSICAL PROMOTION

Ah, there it is. "Azna".

I can't say why I'm doing this
it's continued, it's moved along

and I keep finding things,
I keep finding music.

Every trip that I come,
you focus on a few different projects

that you've been looking for,

but then you hear
just a little bit of something else,

you write that down, you get back home
and start researching that

and then that becomes the project, so...

there are so many things here, that I think
that's what keeps me working.

Is it him who sings like this?
-Yes, it's "Mona".

I was going through the cassettes
and I found one called "Azna de L'Ader".

That's the name of his group
and I listened to it

and it had a bunch of these shredding,
really wild electric guitar solos

and it was really short,
it was just a few songs.

I asked someone about it
and they explained to me,

that it was this guy, Mona,
a guitarist from Tahoua

and he's called the "Jimi Hendrix of Niger"

and he used to
play the guitar with his teeth.

That was the thing
that people knew about Mona.

Like Jimi Hendrix,
that's what grabbed me... Look!

Crazy. Have you seen
the film about Jimi Hendrix?

Did you film this?
-Yes, that was me.

It's good.
Can we go and see him as well?

He had only sung one song
when we arrived

and it was like seeing Jimi Hendrix.

He took the guitar,
he played it, he moved it...

I guess I'm interested in him, because I'm
always interested in music that stands out,

whether it's something now,
that people are making today,

or that stands out in the past.

I'm interested
in hearing what did they do?

They are a supergroup,
they are known everywhere in Niger.

Now I'm looking for more of their music
to see what is it that made them so special.

TAHOUA RADIO STATION

Maybe we could go to the radio station
to see if you have any old music?

Old music?

He never recorded a full album,

so there might be
something on the radio?

You have a lot of things here.
-Yes, that's our sound library.

It contains music dating back to 1974.

Can I help maybe?
-Yes, of course, you're welcome.

Unbelievable.

That's real treasure here...

It's wild, there is so much music here.

Hey Abdoullaye, it's here!

"Mona"!
-Yes. Where did you find it?

That's "play", here.

Like this.
-Yes.

"Stop".
-"Stop", OK.

Hold it here and let it...
-OK, it's fine.

We're going to eat, we'll be back soon.
-OK.

It's like a ribbon,
you could wrap a present with this.

How did it get like this?
This is really insane.

You have to put it in context of...

digitizing old recordings for preservation,

that really is not the priority here

and I don't even know
if that should be the priority.

It's a luxury thing to say…
it's even a privilege to say,

we're going to digitize
and preserve cultural artifacts

when a lot of people are concerned
about health or family or food.

There are more pressing concerns then

putting you're time into
a rock band from Tahoua

from the 70s.
Should that take a priority?

Ah, that's it?
-Yes.

This does everything you hear.

Is it fine if I record a bit?
-Yes, sure.

Was that good?
-It's top-notch, brilliant!

Really?
-Yes, I've listened to this for ages.

Have you?
-Yes, very often.

I DJ'ed this song
in front of huge crowds.

Really?
-Yes, your music is listened to lots.

People really like it here.

Even in the States they love it.
-People love it here.

I'm often asked to play at weddings,

at ceremonies, all that...

You play at weddings?
-Yes, you should see the people there...

It's insane!

I have to say it's the first time
that I hear Tuareg music

played with a keyboard like this.

Since I started working here,

I don't have time
to play at weddings anymore.

I mean, I get offers,

but unless it's at the weekend...

when I know I don't have to work
I can do something.

But at the moment I work on weekdays.

I'm a chauffeur.
-A chauffeur...

A driver.
-A car driver?

Yes, a car driver.

With this
I can make a living for my family.

I have a wife and two kids, two boys.

You have to keep going...

I want to explain a bit
why I'm actually here,

because I haven't said anything
about what I do.

In fact, my project...

I run a project
about music in the Sahel,

it's called "Sahel Sounds".

And since 2009-2010

I've been here in Mali,
Senegal, Mauritania, Niger,

and I'm looking for artists.

I make recordings and I have a website.

I interview the artists,
I take pictures,

I make little clips
and I write about the music.

And I also produce the artists.

I have a music label,

so if I find someone,
among the artists that I get to know,

who interests me
and who I think I could work with,

I release the music commercially

all over the world.

But it's not a big release,
it's on vinyl discs.

You know vinyl?
-Yes.

So, I produce these.

And I was looking for you
because I want to work with you.

I would like to produce this album
that I found.

Just so you know,
it's not something

with a lot of money.

Like I work on it, I do the split.
I take 50% of what I make, you get 50%.

I understand.
-That's the split.

It's fine, that's normal.

But I hope this is something
that will continue,

and that we can make
something out of it.

What's important to me
is that everything is very clear,

that there is trust and it's all clear.

Any question you have you can ask me,

because I want to do this
so that we're both...

the two of us are satisfied,
that's what I want.

If that's fine, let's do it like this.

I will come back after Agadez
and we can talk again.

OK. No problem.

That's all for today, right?

Yes, that's fine. We can rest.

It's night time
and you just finished your work.

Do you want to drink some water?
-Yes, please.

Thanks.

None of this was planned and there it is.

That's why
you have to embrace the deviations,

when something doesn't work out
and something else happens,

you have to run with it.

When I was in college,
I was in my final year and I started...

I didn't really care about it anymore.

I think I spent too much time hanging out
with my friends, who where philosophy majors

and going camping and I didn't really...

We just spent a lot of time discussing
politics and dropping of the grid,

the capitalist system
and "Corporate America".

So I wanted to take off right after college

and travel, but I didn't have the money.
I had a lot of college debts.

And I also thought - man, I put in
all this time getting this degree,

I should go get a job.

So I did. I got a job, I moved to Seattle,

I got an expensive apartment,
I went to IKEA and

bought all this shit
to put in the apartment...

And I felt sort of
like the protagonist of "Fight Club".

One day I went home and the building
next door had burnt down and I thought...

I don't know if you remember that scene?
But yeah, it seemed like...

One time I was on the phone with IKEA
trying to order a specific toothbrush holder

that came in chrome,
and I thought what the fuck am I doing?

This is ridiculous!

So I made this commitment
to myself at that time,

I'm going to save up money until
I have enough to pay of my loans

and then I'm going to take off and travel.

It's good. Do you want some?

When I started playing guitar
it wasn't something that I liked,

but I had to play,

because I was invited
to play at ceremonies all the time.

It became my destiny,

none of my girlfriends
or any other women play guitar.

If other women did
I would be more courageous to do so...

...and I wouldn't be so afraid either.

That's why I love playing "Tende"...

...and singing without being worried
about anything.

I want to have girlfriends
who play guitar...

...so we can play together
and be successful together.

Those are some very green shoes.

Everyone is wearing fluorescent now,

in the US it's like...

Neon shoes! I didn't know
people wearing them here, too.

Is it bad?

No it's cool, it's like the new look,

really bright colored shoes.

I think it was a good in
with musicians, too.

Like showing up with a guitar

to play music together, rather than…
I never showed up to record.

It wasn't like "Hey, I'm here,
you've got a hot band I want to record".

It's like, "Hey I heard there's
a guitarist here, I also have a guitar".

Yeah, it was more like "Oh cool,
you're also an artist, we're the same",

no matter where we're from,
you're an artist, I'm an artist.

I started playing the guitar
when I was a teenager,

when I was 14 years old.

I am playing with a musician
called "Mdou Moctar".

We've been working together since 2010

and I play rhythm guitar for him.

In Niger recordings don't have a problem
getting anywhere,

because everything
works with Bluetooth.

As the connection is very weak,

Bluetooth works
better than the Internet here.

If you record something
and send it to one person,

they'll send it to someone else
and that happens again and again

until it's everywhere.

You hear it somewhere
and it's surprising.

You ask,
"When did this song reach here?"

We play with this one in Europe.

You have to have this in Europe

because when there are drums,
everyone...

Everyone has their own cymbals.

You find the drums without cymbals,

because every drummer
has the cymbals he prefers.

Yes, that's right.

They asked us,
"Which amplifier do you prefer?"

And I said,
"They're all the same to me."

No matter which one you find...

Because all of them are fine, you know.
-Yes, yes.

When I came back to Niger,

I played my first concert over there.

My first concert...

Shit, my voice became so different,
I didn't even understand...

That's awesome.
-No, I couldn't hear anything.

It all sounds horrible.
- Everything changed.

Yeah, because I went to Europe
and the equipment there was so good.

Here I couldn't hear the drums,

I didn't hear my guitar.

The rhythm guitar wasn't any good.

Everything changed into...
-You changed into "Etran" again.

It's no better afterwards...
-Yes.

It's different.

Mdou wants to go on tour

or he's going on tour
for a couple of shows in Europe.

Hello?

Yes?
-I wanted to ask you to send money.

For the visa, right?

For the visa.

And how much is the visa?

It's 45 for 3 persons, right?

45, so it's around 300 dollars.

Right, I see...
But that's impossible.

I don't have 1,000 or 2,000 euros.

Try the same guy you asked last time.

They say 32.50 euros a day
so we're probably going to...

The problem is, when you get a Visa,

a lot of time they want you
to see you have a lot of money.

So a lot of times
what these guys have to do is...

You have to have Euros,
so what they'll do is,

they borrow
a certain amount of CFA Franc,

change it into Euros

and then they have a paper that says,
they changed so many CFA Franc into Euros.

Then they change it back
into CFA Franc again,

then change it again into Euros,
so they got a second form.

Take it again, change it back into Euros
again for a third time,

and now you have
three forms that say

you've converted money
from CFA Franc into Euros.

So it looks like
you have a certain amount of Euros.

Yeah, it's pretty ridiculous!

OK, this is for Düsseldorf,

Mohammadou is the name.

It's written here.
You're not terrorists, right?

This is for you, you need to sign here

and write the date here.

When is the other one?

Yours is at 9:30 am.

Everybody we've got into Europe
is like a success for me.

Just when they've come of the plane...
when Mdou came of the plane,

I was like, "we fucking
done it already, this is it - we won!"

We essentially got you into Europe

and the whole European Union
didn't want you to come here.

Sometimes though it feels like
we're cheating the system,

we're sneaking them into Europe.

And that's great,
because it's bullshit that they,

that somebody from West Africa
can't go to Europe.

I can go to West Africa.

Yeah, I understand
the economics of it, but...

but "Come on"!

This guy is crazy, I dig his music.

It's him who wants to meet you...
-What?

He wants to meet you.

You're kidding?
-No, it's him.

Hey, this guy wants to meet me.
I'm so happy.

Yes, Thomas Azier.

I really dig his music.

Hey man, I'm so happy to meet you.

I like you're music, it's very beautiful.

I'm such a big fan of you, it's crazy.
-I like you're music very much.

I saw your name and I was like
"it can't be true". - Thank you.

I know you through you
basically, through your label.

I ordered your record
and I listened to it so much.

Thank you.

I was 30 minutes in this place, I listened
to your music, I was looking for you,

I said,
I wanted to greet you or something...

I'm so happy to meet you.
-I like your music very well.

I'm such a big fan, I checked everything
that's there to find from you.

Hey, I'm Thomas, nice to meet you.

Are you sometimes in Paris?

What did he say?

We're going to be
in Paris on this tour,

but they're also going to be
back in October/November.

And where are you living now?
Still based in Niger?

In Agadez.
-Okay, very nice.

I'm really happy to meet you too,
how is the label going? - It's great man…

I'm a fucking big fan. - I mean we're
touring so this couldn't be any better.

Very nice. I'm pushing it to everybody,
everything you bring out.

It's very cool.

Can we take a picture together?
I want a picture. -Yeah, of course.

But I don't have my fucking phone...

Perfect.

Mdou Moctar,
what do you think about this boat?

Well, I have to say it's very cool,

but I would rather dive into the water,
it's new for me, you know.

I come from the desert.

And you?
What do you think about this boat?

It's not bad.

The GPS might make the whole thing
even more complicated,

because normally
you drive in the city center,

or on a highway or something similar.

But we're in the middle of nowhere.
It looks like we're in Agadez or Diffa.

Keep filming the road.
-Look at this road.

How would anyone ever believe
that this is a European road?

It looks like the road
between Kao and Tchin-Tabaradene.

Or dare I say,
between Abalak and Illighadad.

OK, Achecouscous,

how do you like Sweden,
since it's new to you?

Well, Sweden is....

That's fine.
-The old woman liked it a lot.

I forgot all the Swedish,

how they spoke: "Hej, hej"...

Christopher is a decent person
who really helps us,

he makes the traveling easy for us

and we are happy
about our tour with him.

Berlin, Berlin.

That's Marseille, right?
-No, it's Berlin.

This is Berlin?
-Yes.

It's with King Khan's guitar.

It looks like it wasn't hot,
but it had 100 degrees.

Like even touring with the musicians
is something I sort of fell into.

If I could get an opportunity for the
artist to get a Visa and go some place,

then of course we're going to do that.

But to be a manager, just because I have a
credit card and they don't and they can't,

That's not really where I want
my success to be is based on...

That I'm successful
because of global inequity.

He has a label, called Sahel Sounds.
He is interested in the music

played by those young musicians in Niger.

Especially to Agadez he used to go and

go on tour with them, like this Mdou.

And there are some others I don't know.

That's how it happened.

I was about to set off, it's enough.

I've been playing this music,
maybe I have to stop,

because there are younger generations.

But I keep on playing,
because I like music.

Good afternoon, my name is Mamman Sani.

I'm a teacher, an English teacher
and I play music for fun.

In Niger they call me the pianist,
but I'm not a pianist.

MAMMANE SANI
AND HIS KEYBOARD

ELECTRONIC MUSIC FROM NIGER

That's good.
Just one more minute here...

OK!

This is the contract I made.

So, just to explain how it works,

I make the record
and after that I sell it.

I don't take exclusive rights,

so if you want to sell your music,

make another CD or another vinyl

and sell it, you can.

I don't take any percentage.

Normally when I make something,

every time I make something new,
I have to send it to you?

You can.
-I want to do it this way.

Why contact someone else?

It's you who came such a long way.

You're the only one I know now

and I trust you as well.

You understood what I said, right?
-Yes.

I just do the creating
and you will do the rest.

You are the one
who knows how to do it.

For me it's really just like...

an assistance that you give me,
that's it.

And you are there,

you prepare the music, you sell it,

you take your cut,
you send me my cut...

As you are experienced
with the whole process,

I simply have to prepare "the sauce"
and you do the tasting.

The "sauce", that's it.

I have a lot of spices in my head.
-Yeah.

It's swollen like this.

See you later.
-Bye.

It's a big thing for me.

It's the first time
something like this is happening to me.

I waited a long time for this
and it fell from heaven.

Yes, he followed me
because of my sound.

He followed my traces
step by step to get to here.

He found me.

Just like that.
Now I feel cool...

Happy.

Where is your country?
-I'm American.

American?
-Yes.

My brother, as soon as I have
some money I want to go there.

Do you?
-Yes.

You want to go there?
-Yes.

I want to go there,
but I don't have any money.

The thing is, it's not...
It's very expensive over there.

Everything is great there.
When I go there... Better than here.

Ah?
-Yes.

I know singers there.

Yeah, I can see.

You mean Rick Ross

and Beyoncé, or what?

When I'm there I will look for work.

But even with work it's not easy there.

Really?
-It's not easy.

Everything is fine in America,
not like here.

You know, over there,
it's very expensive.

That's the problem over there,
life is expensive.

Really?
-Yes.

Where are you from?
-These last few years I was in Libya.

You crossed the Sahara?
-Yes, I've crossed the Sahara before.

It's dangerous!

No problem,
it's like that when you're poor.

Your country is great.

You have water there, you have snow,
it's not like here in Niger.

And Libya? How was it?
-What?

How was Libya?

Libya...
There's enough water there, it's good.

Why did you go to Tripoli? For work?
-Yes, work.

Every month I get money from there.

You didn't try to leave for Europe?

No, Libya is fine.

America is great.

Ah yes... It's not like here.

You watch a lot of hip-hop videos,
dude.

Yes, that's good.
-Yeah, but that's not America!

It is America!
-No, no, no.

Aren't hip-hoppers American?

Yes, but there's a lot of "bla bla"
and bullshit, too.

Hello?

Yes, what's up?

I'll call you back,
I'm at the barbershop.

I will call you back.

Landcruisers, Motorbikes,
"Hausa" pop music,

cellphones, guitar evenings and marriages
and competition between guitarists.

This is all very current stuff

and so I think a lot about
how these things are represented,

how do you conceptualize or contextualize

something that you take out of one place
and put it into another.

I've sent you bad stuff before,
bad quality... this is the worst. -Okay.

These are all .mp3s I got from his
cellphone and his friends cellphones,

and some stuff that was sent
over email, they're pretty low...

But they're really good. It's all,

all of his music is that.

He hasn't recorded anything,
besides the stuff that I recorded for him

it's all cellphone recordings.
So I guess we'll see what we can do.

I'm not expecting it to sound amazing,

I'm going to make that part
of the concept of the record too,

that it is Lo-Fi
and recorded on a cellphone.

That's pretty rough sounding.

It's supposed to sound low.
-That's the worst right there,

but it's such a good track though too.

The audience is always been Westerners.

I wasn't making a blog for people in Niger,

but you have to pretend, that you
are making it for that audience, too.

That's like the first step,
to be just sensitive to that.

Pretty soon in five or ten years,

everything I've ever done
is going to be translated,

it's going to be up there and everybody
here is going to have access to that.

I think you have to be sensitive
and accountable

for what you're making and producing.

So in that sense
I don't think the records and the music

are made for this audience right now,

but they are made for
this audience in the future.

OK, now let's record
the "oweeh, oweehoho".

Ready?

I started to make recordings
for the boys.

When I listen to something
and see that it's good, I produce it.

I try to do that

because that will help develop
my studio a bit,

and help establish
Nigerien music a bit more.

In one year I produced five albums

and 365 singles.

About cell phones,
since people use Bluetooth and so on,

do you think that helps the artists?

They have to let their songs
be shared illegally.

Without illegal sharing
you won't get known.

But with cell phones,
if you release a single

I think it's the best way

to spread the music,
and for it to be listened to abroad too.

I, myself, find a lot of artists
thanks to cell phones.

Every time I come to Africa,
I copy stuff over Bluetooth.

It's the only way to spread our music

beyond our borders.

I think there's going to be
less and less need for managers,

I think there will be less and less
need for labels even like myself,

and that's fine. That's good.

We... I personally love your music,

and it's the same with Chris,
he also loves it.

And after that, you never know,

maybe one day
someone will like your album.

Their recordings
might become an album, you know.

That's it.
-This kind of thing.

Also if something comes my way,

I will call you directly,
we make a contract and everything.

I want to keep things clear.

I was recently called like a...

a "music pirate" by somebody working
in the world music industry.

And I thought it was
sort of funny to be called a "pirate",

because you work directly with artists,
because you bypass that.

At first it wrapped me the wrong way
and then I was like,

but yeah, if a pirate means paying artists
and working with artists,

okay, I'll be a pirate!